Muscle and Brawn Forums
 

Go Back   Muscle and Brawn Forums > Training > Muscle Building and Bodybuilding

Notices

Muscle Building and Bodybuilding Topics related to muscle building, bodybuilding, including training and fullbody workouts. If you are looking for great advice on gaining muscle this forum is for you.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 12-18-2010, 11:53 PM   #1
Rich Knapp
Rich Knapp
100% Natural Bodybuilder
Wheelchair Pro
Max Brawn
Points: 27,020, Level: 97 Points: 27,020, Level: 97 Points: 27,020, Level: 97
Activity: 3% Activity: 3% Activity: 3%
 
Rich Knapp's Avatar
 

Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Appleton, WI
Posts: 6,051
Training Exp: > 13 years
Training Type: Bodybuilding
Fav Supp: AAEFX's whole line.
My Mood: Lurking
Reputation: 148270
Rich Knapp is a master memberRich Knapp is a master memberRich Knapp is a master memberRich Knapp is a master memberRich Knapp is a master memberRich Knapp is a master memberRich Knapp is a master memberRich Knapp is a master memberRich Knapp is a master memberRich Knapp is a master memberRich Knapp is a master member


Default Body measurements

Just did my measurements.
I'm bigger than John McCallum’s chart ideals, but symmetrically little smaller than Steve Reeves ideal.

Q? At what body fat are these measurements to be taken at? Everyone retains fat different and in different areas.

Plus back in Steve's day they didn't get as ripped as present day natural bodybuilders. So in this point Steve's measurements would be at a month out by now days show prep and stage body fat standards. Thus making them a bit high from his true standard for a modern day stage size.

I can see McCallum's being more accurate for a modern day person on stage at 4% body fat or diced and shredded.
NOTE: These sizes now days are a good veteran amateur natural size. Many natural pro's are way beyond these sizes. Goal should be to keep the equal gain beyond these figures for each measurement. Perfect symmetry is what they were driving for..
__________________
DFAC Wheelchair Rep.
"3D Muscle Journey" Sponsored Athlete
"If you think your lean enough. Your 4 weeks out, keep going."

Last edited by Rich Knapp; 12-19-2010 at 12:10 AM.
Rich Knapp is offline   Reply With Quote


Share with Facebook
Sponsored Links
Old 12-19-2010, 09:08 AM   #2
BendtheBar
BendtheBar
is getting skinny(ish)
Bearded Beast of Duloc
Max Brawn
Points: 1,537,705, Level: 100 Points: 1,537,705, Level: 100 Points: 1,537,705, Level: 100
Activity: 50% Activity: 50% Activity: 50%
 
BendtheBar's Avatar
 
Extreme Mini Golf Champion!Tournaments Won: 6

Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 80,558
Training Exp: 20+ years
Training Type: Powerbuilding
Fav Exercise: Deadlift
Fav Supp: Butter
My Mood: Lurking
Reputation: 2572764
BendtheBar is one with Crom!BendtheBar is one with Crom!BendtheBar is one with Crom!BendtheBar is one with Crom!BendtheBar is one with Crom!BendtheBar is one with Crom!BendtheBar is one with Crom!BendtheBar is one with Crom!BendtheBar is one with Crom!BendtheBar is one with Crom!BendtheBar is one with Crom!
Default

Casey Butt studied 300 natural champions from the past 60 years.

The WeighTrainer - Maximum Drug-Free Bodybuilding Potential Calculator

The WeighTrainer - Maximum Drug-Free Bodybuilding Potential

No calculator or analysis is more accurate that Casey Butt's so it's a great reference point. I've never seen a natural pro surpass Casey's predictions.

I'm not diminishing John McCallum’s charts...just never seen them and wanted to point out what Casey had done...

I would like to see McCallum's chart though if anyone has a link?
__________________
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Destroy That Which Destroys You

"Let bravery be thy choice, but not bravado."



Last edited by BendtheBar; 12-19-2010 at 09:31 AM.
BendtheBar is offline   Reply With Quote


Share with Facebook
Old 12-19-2010, 09:12 AM   #3
BendtheBar
BendtheBar
is getting skinny(ish)
Bearded Beast of Duloc
Max Brawn
Points: 1,537,705, Level: 100 Points: 1,537,705, Level: 100 Points: 1,537,705, Level: 100
Activity: 50% Activity: 50% Activity: 50%
 
BendtheBar's Avatar
 
Extreme Mini Golf Champion!Tournaments Won: 6

Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 80,558
Training Exp: 20+ years
Training Type: Powerbuilding
Fav Exercise: Deadlift
Fav Supp: Butter
My Mood: Lurking
Reputation: 2572764
BendtheBar is one with Crom!BendtheBar is one with Crom!BendtheBar is one with Crom!BendtheBar is one with Crom!BendtheBar is one with Crom!BendtheBar is one with Crom!BendtheBar is one with Crom!BendtheBar is one with Crom!BendtheBar is one with Crom!BendtheBar is one with Crom!BendtheBar is one with Crom!
Default

By the way, correct me if I'm wrong but Reeve's chart isn't really about bodyfat. It merely presents a nice symmetry goal as a low but healthy bodyfat percentage.

They certainly would be high for modern ripped standards.

But with that said, most people that lift don't compete and are in a perpetual off-season.
__________________
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Destroy That Which Destroys You

"Let bravery be thy choice, but not bravado."


BendtheBar is offline   Reply With Quote


Share with Facebook
Old 12-19-2010, 09:20 AM   #4
glwanabe
glwanabe
has no status.
Senior Member
Max Brawn
Points: 15,106, Level: 79 Points: 15,106, Level: 79 Points: 15,106, Level: 79
Activity: 0% Activity: 0% Activity: 0%
 

Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 5,268
Reputation: 148251
glwanabe is a master memberglwanabe is a master memberglwanabe is a master memberglwanabe is a master memberglwanabe is a master memberglwanabe is a master memberglwanabe is a master memberglwanabe is a master memberglwanabe is a master memberglwanabe is a master memberglwanabe is a master member


Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by BendtheBar View Post
By the way, correct me if I'm wrong but Reeve's chart isn't really about bodyfat. It merely presents a nice symmetry goal as a low but healthy bodyfat percentage.

They certainly would be high for modern ripped standards.

But with that said, most people that lift don't compete and are in a perpetual off-season.
Yes, I believe this to be correct on all counts.
glwanabe is offline   Reply With Quote


Share with Facebook
Old 12-19-2010, 09:44 AM   #5
glwanabe
glwanabe
has no status.
Senior Member
Max Brawn
Points: 15,106, Level: 79 Points: 15,106, Level: 79 Points: 15,106, Level: 79
Activity: 0% Activity: 0% Activity: 0%
 

Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 5,268
Reputation: 148251
glwanabe is a master memberglwanabe is a master memberglwanabe is a master memberglwanabe is a master memberglwanabe is a master memberglwanabe is a master memberglwanabe is a master memberglwanabe is a master memberglwanabe is a master memberglwanabe is a master memberglwanabe is a master member


Default

Just so we know what we are talking about.

John McCallum’s realistic measurement ideals for hard gainers

1.6.5 times your wrist gives chest girth
2.85% of the chest girth produces the hips
3.Take 70% of the chest girth for the waist
4.53% of the chest gives the thigh girth
5.The neck size is 37% of the chest
6.36% of the chest produces the upper arm girth
7.The calves come out a little less at 34%
8.The forearms get 29% of the chest measurement


Reeves Ideal

Steve Reeves Measurements:

Arms: 18.5 inches
Calves: 18.5 inches
Neck: 18.5 inches
Thighs: 27 inches
Chest: 54 inches
Waist: 30 inches
In his “classic physique” book, Reeves said his formula for “ideal proportions” was as follows:

Muscle to bone ratios:

Arm size = 252% of wrist size
Calf size = 192% of ankle size
Neck Size = 79% of head size
Chest Size = 148% of pelvis size
Waist size = 86% of pelvis size
Thigh size = 175% of knee size
Steve Reeves’ height and weight chart for a bodybuilder (natural)

Height Ideal Weight Height Ideal Weight
5’5” 160lbs 6’0” 200lbs
5’6” 165lbs 6’1” 210lbs
5’7” 170lbs 6’2” 220lbs
5’8” 175lbs 6’3” 230lbs
5’9” 180lbs 6’4” 240lbs
5’10” 185lbs 6’5” 250lbs
5’11” 190lbs
glwanabe is offline   Reply With Quote


Share with Facebook
Old 12-19-2010, 09:45 AM   #6
BendtheBar
BendtheBar
is getting skinny(ish)
Bearded Beast of Duloc
Max Brawn
Points: 1,537,705, Level: 100 Points: 1,537,705, Level: 100 Points: 1,537,705, Level: 100
Activity: 50% Activity: 50% Activity: 50%
 
BendtheBar's Avatar
 
Extreme Mini Golf Champion!Tournaments Won: 6

Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 80,558
Training Exp: 20+ years
Training Type: Powerbuilding
Fav Exercise: Deadlift
Fav Supp: Butter
My Mood: Lurking
Reputation: 2572764
BendtheBar is one with Crom!BendtheBar is one with Crom!BendtheBar is one with Crom!BendtheBar is one with Crom!BendtheBar is one with Crom!BendtheBar is one with Crom!BendtheBar is one with Crom!BendtheBar is one with Crom!BendtheBar is one with Crom!BendtheBar is one with Crom!BendtheBar is one with Crom!
Default John McCallum’s realistic measurement ideals for hard gainers

Thanks to GL for pointing out a link to McCallum:

Quote:
John McCallum’s realistic measurement ideals for hard gainers

1. 6.5 times your wrist gives chest girth
2. 85% of the chest girth produces the hips
3. Take 70% of the chest girth for the waist
4. 53% of the chest gives the thigh girth
5. The neck size is 37% of the chest
6. 36% of the chest produces the upper arm girth
7. The calves come out a little less at 34%
8. The forearms get 29% of the chest measurement
__________________
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Destroy That Which Destroys You

"Let bravery be thy choice, but not bravado."


BendtheBar is offline   Reply With Quote


Share with Facebook
Old 12-19-2010, 10:12 AM   #7
glwanabe
glwanabe
has no status.
Senior Member
Max Brawn
Points: 15,106, Level: 79 Points: 15,106, Level: 79 Points: 15,106, Level: 79
Activity: 0% Activity: 0% Activity: 0%
 

Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 5,268
Reputation: 148251
glwanabe is a master memberglwanabe is a master memberglwanabe is a master memberglwanabe is a master memberglwanabe is a master memberglwanabe is a master memberglwanabe is a master memberglwanabe is a master memberglwanabe is a master memberglwanabe is a master memberglwanabe is a master member


Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich Knapp View Post

Q? At what body fat are these measurements to be taken at? Everyone retains fat different and in different areas.

Plus back in Steve's day they didn't get as ripped as present day natural bodybuilders. So in this point Steve's measurements would be at a month out by now days show prep and stage body fat standards. Thus making them a bit high from his true standard for a modern day stage size.

I'll do some digging Rich and see if I can find a better answer to your question. I have Brawn at home, and there may be some info in the chapter that talks about this.
glwanabe is offline   Reply With Quote


Share with Facebook
Old 12-19-2010, 03:26 PM   #8
Rich Knapp
Rich Knapp
100% Natural Bodybuilder
Wheelchair Pro
Max Brawn
Points: 27,020, Level: 97 Points: 27,020, Level: 97 Points: 27,020, Level: 97
Activity: 3% Activity: 3% Activity: 3%
 
Rich Knapp's Avatar
 

Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Appleton, WI
Posts: 6,051
Training Exp: > 13 years
Training Type: Bodybuilding
Fav Supp: AAEFX's whole line.
My Mood: Lurking
Reputation: 148270
Rich Knapp is a master memberRich Knapp is a master memberRich Knapp is a master memberRich Knapp is a master memberRich Knapp is a master memberRich Knapp is a master memberRich Knapp is a master memberRich Knapp is a master memberRich Knapp is a master memberRich Knapp is a master memberRich Knapp is a master member


Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by BendtheBar View Post
Casey Butt studied 300 natural champions from the past 60 years.
I would like to see McCallum's chart though if anyone has a link?
Casey also added at what B/F %'s to take the readings at (at roughly 8 to 10% body fat) .

So this would be at the start of cutting generally for a bber that dose 2 shows a year, 1 spring and 1 fall were you don't put on a lot of fat between shows. If you do 1 show a year and have a heavy bulk it would be a few months in.

On average 99% of people under estimate there B/F by a good 2-3%. If you do the fames 7 Point pinch test. It will come up with a reading on average 2% lower than your true B/F %. Electric tests like the hand held and stand on's any water and sodium changes day to day will majorly effect the reading seen as it is testing the current flow threw the water, fat and muscle tissue. Junior High Science teaches us that.
The tank dunk test is the ONLY 99% ACCURATE test.
__________________
DFAC Wheelchair Rep.
"3D Muscle Journey" Sponsored Athlete
"If you think your lean enough. Your 4 weeks out, keep going."

Last edited by Rich Knapp; 12-19-2010 at 03:44 PM.
Rich Knapp is offline   Reply With Quote


Share with Facebook
Old 12-19-2010, 06:55 PM   #9
glwanabe
glwanabe
has no status.
Senior Member
Max Brawn
Points: 15,106, Level: 79 Points: 15,106, Level: 79 Points: 15,106, Level: 79
Activity: 0% Activity: 0% Activity: 0%
 

Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 5,268
Reputation: 148251
glwanabe is a master memberglwanabe is a master memberglwanabe is a master memberglwanabe is a master memberglwanabe is a master memberglwanabe is a master memberglwanabe is a master memberglwanabe is a master memberglwanabe is a master memberglwanabe is a master memberglwanabe is a master member


Default

I looked through Brawn in the chapter that talks about McCallums ideals. They don't talk about specific BF% for these measurements. They only say a body in a hard condition, rather than a soft one.

That could mean a range of several % either way, but I would think that 12-13% is not out of the question. I think this is a BF% that most people could maintain with some disipline, but not adhering to a super strict diet.

In any case I do think it is a good idea to have some sort of an idea as to what proportion's you should be aiming for. The better your plan, the better the chance you have of success. At any rate these are ideals, and as they point out, very few people are ideal. Not everybody will achieve these stats. Temper your expectations with some honesty about you somotype, but don't let that stop you from busting your butt to achieve 100% of what you are capable of.



Anibal Lopez. very much an ecto type frame. Still the man achieved great success.




He looks great on this cover shot. Ripped, with great symmetry.




Lopez, Anibal
glwanabe is offline   Reply With Quote


Share with Facebook
Old 12-19-2010, 07:19 PM   #10
Rich Knapp
Rich Knapp
100% Natural Bodybuilder
Wheelchair Pro
Max Brawn
Points: 27,020, Level: 97 Points: 27,020, Level: 97 Points: 27,020, Level: 97
Activity: 3% Activity: 3% Activity: 3%
 
Rich Knapp's Avatar
 

Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Appleton, WI
Posts: 6,051
Training Exp: > 13 years
Training Type: Bodybuilding
Fav Supp: AAEFX's whole line.
My Mood: Lurking
Reputation: 148270
Rich Knapp is a master memberRich Knapp is a master memberRich Knapp is a master memberRich Knapp is a master memberRich Knapp is a master memberRich Knapp is a master memberRich Knapp is a master memberRich Knapp is a master memberRich Knapp is a master memberRich Knapp is a master memberRich Knapp is a master member


Default

I found the %'s at the top link BTB posted.

But yes you are right. And I never seen a judge stop a show to measure people.
__________________
DFAC Wheelchair Rep.
"3D Muscle Journey" Sponsored Athlete
"If you think your lean enough. Your 4 weeks out, keep going."
Rich Knapp is offline   Reply With Quote


Share with Facebook
Reply

Bookmarks

Tags
body, measurements


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Body fat 79tx General Fitness & Health 18 06-19-2012 05:48 PM
Your Maximum Muscular Bodyweight and Measurements BendtheBar Workouts 15 06-12-2012 09:05 AM
Body Fat % Rich Knapp Nutrition, Diet and Supplements 0 03-07-2012 01:17 PM
Body Fat Calculations and finding your body fat %. Rich Knapp Muscle Building and Bodybuilding 2 06-07-2011 05:59 AM
The Body Shop Vol 4: Building the Perfect Body Iron Gladiator General Board 0 03-24-2010 09:40 AM

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:01 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.