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Nutrition, Diet and Supplements Discuss nutrition, diet, cutting and weight loss. Supplement discussions as well.

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Old 03-13-2014, 02:12 PM   #11
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Rather than editing my post, I will just make my statement in a new post.

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Old 03-13-2014, 03:33 PM   #12
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For me a calorie is calorie in the long run. I eat a lot of whole foods, but have no issue eating 2 5 guys burgers or sticking a snickers bar to melt in my sweet potato and maintain my daily macros/fibre intake. Not to mention people eating 5k plus calories a day might want to do that on only whole foods, thats tremendous food volume. Which is the benfit of whole foods as well. If you track your food, eat alot of whole foods there is no reason why cant have flexibility.
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Old 03-13-2014, 05:55 PM   #13
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Calories are calories, and we have all heard of the Twinkie diet guy.

But like I posted on another forum: if your TDEE is 2500calories, and you want to drop a few pounds, which diet is better: 2000 calories of meat and veggies, or 2000 calories of Twinkies?
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Old 03-13-2014, 07:43 PM   #14
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When it comes to changes in body composition a calorie is indeed a calorie. A 500 kcal deficit will always be a 500 kcal deficits and induce the same fat loss.

For health purposes it's obviously a bad idea to eat 3000 kcal worth of cookies every day.

That's pretty much THE problem with the CLEAN vs IIFYM debate. No one ever specifies if they are arguing from a health benefits or body composition perspective, which often leads to endless debates that go absolutely nowhere.

Add to that the fact that many people (IIFYM'ers and non IIFYM'ers) think that IIFYM implies that dietary fibre and micronutrients are of no value and you have a recipe for misunderstanding disaster. Which is why I prefer to use the term 'Flexible Dieting' over 'If it fits your macros'.
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Old 03-13-2014, 07:53 PM   #15
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Kleurplaay not sure I understand. Are you really saying that a 500 cal deficit on Twinkies only would result in the same body composition changes as a 500 cal deficit thru meat/veggies?

To get numbers-y, a 2500 calorie diet requires 25 servings* of Twinkies per day, which in turn garners one about 57 grams of protein. Is that really going to result in the same body composition as a diet with, say 160 grams of protein per day?


p.s this works out to just about 2500 grams, or a little over a pound of Twinkies.
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Old 03-13-2014, 07:57 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by mr_bigmuscles View Post
Kleurplaay not sure I understand. Are you really saying that a 500 cal deficit on Twinkies only would result in the same body composition changes as a 500 cal deficit thru meat/veggies?

To get numbers-y, a 2500 calorie diet requires 25 servings* of Twinkies per day, which in turn garners one about 57 grams of protein. Is that really going to result in the same body composition as a diet with, say 160 grams of protein per day?


p.s this works out to just about 2500 grams, or a little over a pound of Twinkies.
Well said, IMO.
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Old 03-13-2014, 08:04 PM   #17
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To be clear I am asking because his last sentence (re: micronutrients, health) seems at odds with the first.
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Old 03-13-2014, 08:11 PM   #18
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Kleurplaay not sure I understand. Are you really saying that a 500 cal deficit on Twinkies only would result in the same body composition changes as a 500 cal deficit thru meat/veggies?

To get numbers-y, a 2500 calorie diet requires 25 servings* of Twinkies per day, which in turn garners one about 57 grams of protein. Is that really going to result in the same body composition as a diet with, say 160 grams of protein per day?


p.s this works out to just about 2500 grams, or a little over a pound of Twinkies.
Good point. The human body would still have to 'gather' the same amount of kcal (500) on both diets.
This particular diet though also has the problem of very low protein, that would probably result in you losing more muscle mass and less fat mass compared to a diet higher in protein.

So you're right in the sense that WHAT you lose is different in this particular scenario. But the amount is still the same (although weight loss may then vary since fat and muscle mass do not contain the same amount of kcal/gram).
This 'problem' would be solved by adding extra protein into the diet. But it would still be a shitty diet. Please don't go on an all twinky & bacon diet .

edit: basically what you are describing is not a consequence of the 'dirtyness' (assuming that by this we mean very low micronutrients/fibre) of the diet, but rather the low protein content. A diet consisting of exclusively whole foods, veggies, fruit etc would cause the same issue (excessive muscle loss) if protein intake is too low. Actually this is a somewhat semi-common problem among vegans, since it can be difficult to get in enough protein from your diet when eating all vegan (but definitely not impossible).
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Old 03-13-2014, 08:13 PM   #19
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Are you implying that eating a pound of Twinkies per day is not optimal for health and performance?
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Old 03-13-2014, 08:18 PM   #20
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Are you implying that eating a pound of Twinkies per day is not optimal for health and performance?
Sssshh this is going to be the title of my paper which is going to make me famous.
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