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Old 05-10-2014, 10:29 AM   #1321
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ravimolasaria View Post
Thanks!

Quote:
Originally Posted by KD5NFW View Post
With the iron it's all about "what have you done for me lately" lol, so I would consider that 380 a PR

I think you should incorporate that SS into your routine more until the shoulder feels 100%.
Exactly... I was feeling cheap to say my best pull was 405 when it was years ago.

You may be right. shoulder feels ok today, but I would rather it feel great!
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Old 05-10-2014, 11:51 AM   #1322
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Great lifting JD. Looks like pulls are getting back up nicely. 405 is a matter of time.
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Old 05-10-2014, 12:36 PM   #1323
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Originally Posted by jdmalm123 View Post
On a 4-week cycle going forward. Each week there is a PR scheduled in either the Squat, Dead lift, Bench or Military Press. On the PR week for one of the lifts, the other three lifts will be at either 85% for a triple, 90% for a triple, or, 95% for a double. This way, individual lifts are light or heavy, but entire workouts or weeks are not light or heavy. You are basically always deloading something without taking time off...this should work for me as the total average output stays level instead of everything ramping to a simultaneous max, then everything resetting.

That kind of loading/deloading was too much of a roller coaster and was killing my momentum. 4-5 weeks was the observed timeframe when I would start to feel fatigued if I was hitting multiple PR efforts at the same time. A week off or a week of deload wasn't enough to properly recover from that approach and two weeks off would kill my strength and get me out of the groove.
Very interesting and enlightening stuff, thanks for posting.

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Originally Posted by jdmalm123 View Post
I was feeling cheap to say my best pull was 405 when it was years ago.
I prefer to dine out on lifts I did years ago.


Great lifting JD!
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Old 05-10-2014, 12:46 PM   #1324
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Very interesting and enlightening stuff, thanks for posting.

I prefer to dine out on lifts I did years ago.


Great lifting JD!
Thanks, Tann. My "used to lifts" are still motivation!

To help clarify, the periodization looks like this:

Week 1: DL 85% x 3 (basically the working deload since it follows the PR and could easily be 4-5 reps)
Week 2: DL 90% x 3
Week 3: DL 95% x 2
Week 4: DL PR attempt x 1

Squatting, Bench and Military Press follow the same rotation, but they are staggered.

So, the week of the DL PR, Squats are at 90%, Bench is at 85% and MP is at 95%.
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Old 05-11-2014, 09:00 AM   #1325
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A note I wrote to someone else almost a year ago, which ends up being a conversation with myself when I re-read it. Also, this is not Wendler/Westside bashing, just my perspective on programming...

First, your lifts are excellent, better than I may ever achieve, so keep that in mind if my comments don't jive with your experience.

Not specifically recommending Rippetoe or westside. Rippetoe makes good programming points that are essentially KISS.

I'm kinda against Westside for most because it's too brutal for the average lifter not trying to be competitive, has a higher risk of injury and requires a lot of close coaching to do right. The best part of Westside, 5/3/1, etc is the periodization. However a much simpler version of those programs should work for most. I like to think of it as having 2-3 routines that you progress in at the same time. When your doing lighter/volume work it's a functional break from heavy lifting, but you're never more than 1-3 weeks away from lifting heavy and still lifting regularly. It is also a nice blend of strength and hypertrophy.

If you're emphasizing hypertrophy, volume and frequency are more important and heavy lifting can be less frequent (enough to maintain strength). The % based programs emphasize strength progression so evaluate if you're working "too hard" for your goals.

About periodization vs. Wendler/etc: They periodize for a very specific purpose and program based on their response, strengths and weaknesses, then sell the program to us. We need to understand the concepts and design a program for us. That's where the template can do you wrong. Wendler's pace and strengths are not yours or mine... programs need to be personalized without being "made up." A close read of the books I mentioned should be helpful as a start.

If you truly can't OHP, then it's out. If you can OHP DB's only then do that, even if you really want to BB press. Or, do you have the patience and desire to BB press the bar for (higher but reasonable) reps, add 5 lbs every other week and let your body heal itself? We can't fix anything if we ignore the current reality. I firmly believe the right program and recovery can fix anything...my back surgery and many other significant soft tissue injury recoveries prove that to me!

... Physician heal thyself!

For you, set the bar based on your end goal but that goal has to include all injuries, your patience, and the rest of your training variables (food, sleep, stress, consistency). So, for example, if an 800 lb dead lift was something you consider possible under "perfect" conditions, subtract for all other limitations. If you did 650 in gear, maybe 650 raw is your upper limit... just my illustration, not a scientific projection.

You can't say, I want a 800 lb dead lift and then just charge. What was your best? What happened when you got there? Why? What's changed since?

I was so proud to pull 405 after my surgery, but I did it wrong. I was adding 10lbs per week. Prior week was 390x3. Should have gone for 400x1 and then taken a week off (since it was a true 1RM). But, no. I did 405 because 4 plates seemed cooler. Then after I pulled 405, I did a drop set of 365x3-5 and hurt myself (drop sets were not part of my program, but I thought I needed more reps!).

5 extra pounds and not knowing when enough was enough did me in. I had back strain that prevented me from lifting at all for a while, put a damper on my vacation and short circuited my progression. I've never gotten close to 405 since because the experience ended badly. I'm finally working back to it, but don't expect much more after that. My stretch goal is 500x1, but that's "made up" until I get back in the neighborhood.

Your lifts are exceptional. When I've talked with older, competitive lifters in the 600+ range, some of them dead lifted 1x/month! Their dead lift and form was fine. It was everything else they focused on and then tested to see if the assistance, recovery, etc worked or not. That will seem like slow progress/feedback, but it's reality after a point and rushing it on willpower does not work. Tortoise and the Hare. Move the mountain one grain of sand at a time. Wisdom and patience become more important than guts and suffering.

Also, zoom in on your goals and vision. If you pulled 100 lbs more than your prior best, but looked the same, would you be happy? Do you really just want to stop hurting and be able to do everyday things without your lifting becoming limitation? When you find answers to questions like these, your program will be obvious and your enthusiasm will spike.

You already clarified your vision a bit. Make a program, try it out, and tweak as you go. If you have a plan and realize it's not working, it is not a wasted workout. Failure is the only path to success. Keep learning and avoid injury and you'll be unstoppable.

Never feel bad if you can't do a move, need a brace, have a geared-only lift, take hot bubble baths or whatever it is that works for YOU. Worry about your success and don't get hurt chasing Wendler or someone else's goal.
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Old 05-11-2014, 09:46 AM   #1326
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Default McGill's **DAILY, MORNING** Back Routine

http://www.ahs.uwaterloo.ca/~mcgill/...adersguide.pdf

Used these and other's by McGill to rehab from lumbar spine surgery in 2000.

Injury prevention is worth the time!!!


"Many of the traditional approaches for training other joints in the body are not appropriate for the back – either they do not produce the desired result or they create new patients. "

"Caveats for Exercise

1. While there is a common belief among some "experts" that exercise sessions should be performed at least 3 times per week, it appears low back exercises have the most beneficial effect when performed daily.

2. The "no pain-no gain" axiom does not apply when exercising the low back in pained individuals particularly when applied to weight training, and scientific and clinical wisdom would suggest the opposite is true.

3. While specific low back exercises have been rationalized in this guide, general exercise programs that also combine cardiovascular components (like walking) have been shown to be more effective in both rehabilitation and for injury prevention. The exercises shown here only comprise a component of the total program.

4. Diurnal variation in the fluid level of the intervertebral discs (discs are more hydrated early in the morning after rising from bed), changes the stresses on the disc throughout the day. Specifically, they are highest following bedrest and diminish over the subsequent few hours. It would be very unwise to perform full range spine motion while under load, shortly after rising from bed.

5. Low back exercises performed for maintenance of health need not emphasize strength, with high-load low repetition tasks, rather more repetitions of less demanding exercises will assist in the enhancement of endurance and strength. There is no doubt that back injury can occur during seemingly low level demands (such as picking up a pencil) and that the risk of injury from motor control error can occur. While it appears that the chance
of motor control errors, resulting in inappropriate muscle forces, increase with fatigue there is also evidence documenting the changes in passive tissue loading with fatiguing lifting. Given that endurance has more protective value than strength, strength gains should not be overemphasized at the expense of endurance.

6. There is no such thing as an ideal set of exercises for all individuals. An individual's training objectives must be identified, (be they rehabilitation, specifically to reduce the risk of injury, optimize general health and fitness, or maximize athletic performance), and the most appropriate exercises chosen. While science cannot evaluate the optimal exercises for each situation, the combination of science and clinical experiential "wisdom" must be utilized to enhance low back health.

7. Be patient and stick with the program. Increased function and reduction pain may not occur for 3 months."
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Old 05-11-2014, 10:01 AM   #1327
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Great write-ups and articles. Very helpful.
I agree with the philosophy of taking it slow and babying the back. Steady progression and keeping the ego in check seem to have worked for me so far.
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Old 05-11-2014, 10:05 AM   #1328
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Booch10 View Post
Great write-ups and articles. Very helpful.
I agree with the philosophy of taking it slow and babying the back. Steady progression and keeping the ego in check seem to have worked for me so far.
No joke!

If guys like us had the right info at age 16, we'd be the ones setting world records....no doubt!
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Old 05-11-2014, 11:50 AM   #1329
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdmalm123 View Post
http://www.ahs.uwaterloo.ca/~mcgill/...adersguide.pdf

Used these and other's by McGill to rehab from lumbar spine surgery in 2000.

Injury prevention is worth the time!!!


"Many of the traditional approaches for training other joints in the body are not appropriate for the back either they do not produce the desired result or they create new patients. "

"Caveats for Exercise

1. While there is a common belief among some "experts" that exercise sessions should be performed at least 3 times per week, it appears low back exercises have the most beneficial effect when performed daily.

2. The "no pain-no gain" axiom does not apply when exercising the low back in pained individuals particularly when applied to weight training, and scientific and clinical wisdom would suggest the opposite is true.

3. While specific low back exercises have been rationalized in this guide, general exercise programs that also combine cardiovascular components (like walking) have been shown to be more effective in both rehabilitation and for injury prevention. The exercises shown here only comprise a component of the total program.

4. Diurnal variation in the fluid level of the intervertebral discs (discs are more hydrated early in the morning after rising from bed), changes the stresses on the disc throughout the day. Specifically, they are highest following bedrest and diminish over the subsequent few hours. It would be very unwise to perform full range spine motion while under load, shortly after rising from bed.

5. Low back exercises performed for maintenance of health need not emphasize strength, with high-load low repetition tasks, rather more repetitions of less demanding exercises will assist in the enhancement of endurance and strength. There is no doubt that back injury can occur during seemingly low level demands (such as picking up a pencil) and that the risk of injury from motor control error can occur. While it appears that the chance
of motor control errors, resulting in inappropriate muscle forces, increase with fatigue there is also evidence documenting the changes in passive tissue loading with fatiguing lifting. Given that endurance has more protective value than strength, strength gains should not be overemphasized at the expense of endurance.

6. There is no such thing as an ideal set of exercises for all individuals. An individual's training objectives must be identified, (be they rehabilitation, specifically to reduce the risk of injury, optimize general health and fitness, or maximize athletic performance), and the most appropriate exercises chosen. While science cannot evaluate the optimal exercises for each situation, the combination of science and clinical experiential "wisdom" must be utilized to enhance low back health.

7. Be patient and stick with the program. Increased function and reduction pain may not occur for 3 months."
Good stuff man.
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Old 05-12-2014, 10:23 PM   #1330
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Warm up: mini-band shoulder stuff, 6# Med Ball for various moves, BW squats

MILITARY PRESS
Bradford x many
95x3
105x1
115x1
125x1
135x1
145x1
155x1
165x1
175x FAIL (PR match attempt)

PULL UP
BW x 15 singles

SQUAT
135x1
145x1
155x1
165x1
185x1
205x1
225x1
245x1
265x1
280x1,1

3" RACK PULL
225x1
315x1
405x1 doh
405x1 doh
405x1 doh

Fat Bar Reverse Curl
35x3
45x3
55x3
65x3
75x3

4# Sledgehammer Forearm Lever
5 handwidths x 10 rotation
5 handwidths x 10 radial deviation
5 handwidths x 10 ulnar deviation

Neck Headstrap - Extension
10x10
15x15

Comments
Apparently, my confidence in beating my MP PR of 175x1 is justified since I almost hit it again tonight and haven't pressed heavy since September!

Squats felt a little heavy, but I expect that's mainly due to Friday's DL PR...

405 DOH 3" pulls were still rolling a little but I was able to hold them for several seconds. Fingers roll to a point then hold.

The lever moves felt better than last week...left was a little weaker than right, but it seemed more related to coordination than strength...

Reverse FB curls were heavy-ish at 75 lbs...will repeat weights

Neck extensions are feeling good!
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