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Old 09-14-2012, 09:57 PM   #1
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Default Who built a great body with full body workouts?

First of I want to say sorry for once gain repeating a stupid comment made by a trainer at my gym as I did not want to do this again however I just could not let this one go. Today I was told this by a trainer

“Full body workouts are such a terrible way to train, no one is going get a great body on a full body routine “

Please give me some examples of people who have used full body workouts to build an awesome physique and that you are almost certain did not use steroids

Thanks for any response
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Old 09-14-2012, 10:19 PM   #2
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Originally Posted by abett07 View Post
First of I want to say sorry for once gain repeating a stupid comment made by a trainer at my gym as I did not want to do this again however I just could not let this one go. Today I was told this by a trainer

“Full body workouts are such a terrible way to train, no one is going get a great body on a full body routine “

Please give me some examples of people who have used full body workouts to build an awesome physique and that you are almost certain did not use steroids

Thanks for any response
Most classic bodybuilders till 1950s, before the steroid era used full body routines. Here's a sampling of the better known bodybuilders from that era.

John Grimek


Reg Parks


Steve Reeves


Clarence Ross


Alan Stephan


Jack Delinger


George Eifferman


Dick Dubois (if I am not mistaken, at least while he trained with Reeves)


Manohar Aich (picture at the age of 94)


And even sweet baby Arnold - starting out, before getting on roids, Arnold idolized Reg Parks and followed 5x5 routines. Evidently, they worked pretty well for him too, as evidenced by his photographs at the age of 17


Amongst the modern day natties, Tony Montalbano trains almost exclusively on full body routines, especially during the off season.

Last edited by kitarpyar; 09-14-2012 at 10:48 PM.
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Old 09-17-2012, 10:23 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by kitarpyar View Post
Most classic bodybuilders till 1950s, before the steroid era used full body routines. Here's a sampling of the better known bodybuilders from that era.

John Grimek


Reg Parks


Steve Reeves


Clarence Ross


Alan Stephan


Jack Delinger


George Eifferman


Dick Dubois (if I am not mistaken, at least while he trained with Reeves)


Manohar Aich (picture at the age of 94)


And even sweet baby Arnold - starting out, before getting on roids, Arnold idolized Reg Parks and followed 5x5 routines. Evidently, they worked pretty well for him too, as evidenced by his photographs at the age of 17


Amongst the modern day natties, Tony Montalbano trains almost exclusively on full body routines, especially during the off season.
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Old 09-14-2012, 10:34 PM   #4
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Glad you mentioned Arnold. Even the now infamous "Arnold routine" looked more like a mutated fullbody than a modern split.

I believe Arnold had 19" arms by the age of 19. I am speculating based on picture that he had built 80% of his mass before he had moved beyond basic programs.
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Old 09-14-2012, 11:32 PM   #5
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if someone uses a fullbody workout does it mean that they are almost certainly not on steroids?
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Old 09-14-2012, 11:43 PM   #6
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if someone uses a fullbody workout does it mean that they are almost certainly not on steroids?
Not necessarily.
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Old 09-15-2012, 12:17 AM   #7
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if someone uses a fullbody workout does it mean that they are almost certainly not on steroids?
Absolutely not.

Hard work is hard work is hard work. If you work your tail off you'll gain on nearly any program. The program is not the magic. People obsess about the minutiae of programming way too much.

Modern bodybuilding has become all about beating the snot out of bodyparts. It works, but that doesn't mean if 99% of these guys were born into fullbody era that they wouldn't be just as big. They would because they train hard, listen to their bodies and evolve their training.

Because it has become the norm to hit each bodypart with a lot of work, bodybuilders require more rest between training days. It's not just the muscles being demolished, but the joints, connective tissue, etc.

I guarantee if you forced them to use fullbodies they would modify these workouts in ways to get the same results. They would do what it took, with focus and intensity, and get it done.

Look at DC training...it's nothing more than a simple A/B split. It's low volume, 3 days per week, but uses rest pause to up the ante'. A lot of guys are getting huge off DC training. Is it magic? No. What DC training reveals is that if you work hard, you might not need a bazillion sets per bodypart after all - and that frequency might actually be an option.

I want to repeat...people obsess way too much about splits and the minor parts of programming that really don't matter (yet). People who are successful are dedicated, work hard, have attention to detail, modify diet and training to fit their needs, and would succeed in just about any era.

I have interviewed over 100 natural bodybuilders in the last 3-4 years and not a single one uses fullbody workouts. Why? because they are simply not in the magazines. But they are making a strong comeback on the Internet, as is basic training. Balance is being restored because there are more voices.

We as lifters need to stop thinking in terms of fullbody vs. splits and start viewing them in their proper context. Newbs need frequency, form practice and can recover more quickly because of the low relative intensity. They don't need 10 pound flyes or dumbbell laterals. They don't need to bomb, blitz and blast every muscle from every angle using every possible machine and piece of equipment in the gym. They can barely lift a dumbbell without getting DOMS, and can gain doing just about anything if they progress and eat enough. They need to build stability, learn form, and build some semblance of strength. This is just common sense.

Fundamentals and basics first. Build a base, like every other hobby and sport. Marathoners don't start running 10 miles per day. There are many variables at play here. Different recovery needs and demands for different skill levels, form levels, recovery levels, strength levels, whatever levels.

If any trainer doesn't see this, or understand this, ignore them. End of story. They have their heads in a dark hole.

I don't believe it's an either/or question. I believe that both have a time and a place, but they shouldn't be forced. We shouldn't just hop around to programs for random reasons...now I can lift X, I must do a split. Wouldn't it make more sense to base changes on current needs? I think so.

Whatever programming evolves into, it evolves into. Every advanced lifter trains different. They aren't concerned with what programming looks like on paper, nor do most arbitrarily align things for dogmatic reasons. They might stick to splits, but they are highly modified to fit individual needs.

Think...start simple, evolve based on needs.
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Old 09-17-2012, 11:58 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BendtheBar View Post
Absolutely not.

Hard work is hard work is hard work. If you work your tail off you'll gain on nearly any program. The program is not the magic. People obsess about the minutiae of programming way too much.

Modern bodybuilding has become all about beating the snot out of bodyparts. It works, but that doesn't mean if 99% of these guys were born into fullbody era that they wouldn't be just as big. They would because they train hard, listen to their bodies and evolve their training.

Because it has become the norm to hit each bodypart with a lot of work, bodybuilders require more rest between training days. It's not just the muscles being demolished, but the joints, connective tissue, etc.

I guarantee if you forced them to use fullbodies they would modify these workouts in ways to get the same results. They would do what it took, with focus and intensity, and get it done.

Look at DC training...it's nothing more than a simple A/B split. It's low volume, 3 days per week, but uses rest pause to up the ante'. A lot of guys are getting huge off DC training. Is it magic? No. What DC training reveals is that if you work hard, you might not need a bazillion sets per bodypart after all - and that frequency might actually be an option.

I want to repeat...people obsess way too much about splits and the minor parts of programming that really don't matter (yet). People who are successful are dedicated, work hard, have attention to detail, modify diet and training to fit their needs, and would succeed in just about any era.

I have interviewed over 100 natural bodybuilders in the last 3-4 years and not a single one uses fullbody workouts. Why? because they are simply not in the magazines. But they are making a strong comeback on the Internet, as is basic training. Balance is being restored because there are more voices.

We as lifters need to stop thinking in terms of fullbody vs. splits and start viewing them in their proper context. Newbs need frequency, form practice and can recover more quickly because of the low relative intensity. They don't need 10 pound flyes or dumbbell laterals. They don't need to bomb, blitz and blast every muscle from every angle using every possible machine and piece of equipment in the gym. They can barely lift a dumbbell without getting DOMS, and can gain doing just about anything if they progress and eat enough. They need to build stability, learn form, and build some semblance of strength. This is just common sense.

Fundamentals and basics first. Build a base, like every other hobby and sport. Marathoners don't start running 10 miles per day. There are many variables at play here. Different recovery needs and demands for different skill levels, form levels, recovery levels, strength levels, whatever levels.

If any trainer doesn't see this, or understand this, ignore them. End of story. They have their heads in a dark hole.

I don't believe it's an either/or question. I believe that both have a time and a place, but they shouldn't be forced. We shouldn't just hop around to programs for random reasons...now I can lift X, I must do a split. Wouldn't it make more sense to base changes on current needs? I think so.

Whatever programming evolves into, it evolves into. Every advanced lifter trains different. They aren't concerned with what programming looks like on paper, nor do most arbitrarily align things for dogmatic reasons. They might stick to splits, but they are highly modified to fit individual needs.

Think...start simple, evolve based on needs.
Great answer!
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Old 09-18-2012, 06:54 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BendtheBar View Post
Absolutely not.

Hard work is hard work is hard work. If you work your tail off you'll gain on nearly any program. The program is not the magic. People obsess about the minutiae of programming way too much.

Modern bodybuilding has become all about beating the snot out of bodyparts. It works, but that doesn't mean if 99% of these guys were born into fullbody era that they wouldn't be just as big. They would because they train hard, listen to their bodies and evolve their training.

Because it has become the norm to hit each bodypart with a lot of work, bodybuilders require more rest between training days. It's not just the muscles being demolished, but the joints, connective tissue, etc.

I guarantee if you forced them to use fullbodies they would modify these workouts in ways to get the same results. They would do what it took, with focus and intensity, and get it done.

Look at DC training...it's nothing more than a simple A/B split. It's low volume, 3 days per week, but uses rest pause to up the ante'. A lot of guys are getting huge off DC training. Is it magic? No. What DC training reveals is that if you work hard, you might not need a bazillion sets per bodypart after all - and that frequency might actually be an option.

I want to repeat...people obsess way too much about splits and the minor parts of programming that really don't matter (yet). People who are successful are dedicated, work hard, have attention to detail, modify diet and training to fit their needs, and would succeed in just about any era.

I have interviewed over 100 natural bodybuilders in the last 3-4 years and not a single one uses fullbody workouts. Why? because they are simply not in the magazines. But they are making a strong comeback on the Internet, as is basic training. Balance is being restored because there are more voices.

We as lifters need to stop thinking in terms of fullbody vs. splits and start viewing them in their proper context. Newbs need frequency, form practice and can recover more quickly because of the low relative intensity. They don't need 10 pound flyes or dumbbell laterals. They don't need to bomb, blitz and blast every muscle from every angle using every possible machine and piece of equipment in the gym. They can barely lift a dumbbell without getting DOMS, and can gain doing just about anything if they progress and eat enough. They need to build stability, learn form, and build some semblance of strength. This is just common sense.

Fundamentals and basics first. Build a base, like every other hobby and sport. Marathoners don't start running 10 miles per day. There are many variables at play here. Different recovery needs and demands for different skill levels, form levels, recovery levels, strength levels, whatever levels.

If any trainer doesn't see this, or understand this, ignore them. End of story. They have their heads in a dark hole.

I don't believe it's an either/or question. I believe that both have a time and a place, but they shouldn't be forced. We shouldn't just hop around to programs for random reasons...now I can lift X, I must do a split. Wouldn't it make more sense to base changes on current needs? I think so.

Whatever programming evolves into, it evolves into. Every advanced lifter trains different. They aren't concerned with what programming looks like on paper, nor do most arbitrarily align things for dogmatic reasons. They might stick to splits, but they are highly modified to fit individual needs.

Think...start simple, evolve based on needs.
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Old 09-19-2012, 01:58 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by BendtheBar View Post
Hard work is hard work is hard work. If you work your tail off you'll gain on nearly any program. The program is not the magic. People obsess about the minutiae of programming way too much.
And they forget food.

A new client started on Sunday, I introduced him to four guys I've trained. Some have trained for 6 months, some for 2 years. All are reasonably strong by community gym standards, but all of them have pretty much the same physique as they started with. The overweight guy is overweight, the stocky guy is stocky, the runty guy is runty, and so on.

Why? They didn't change their food. It doesn't matter which routine I give them or how well I coach their lifts - if their food stays the same, so will their bodies.

If you eat like a sparrow you cannot expect to be built like an ox. If you eat like a horse you cannot expect to be built like a greyhound.

Food is important, and failure to address it at least as thoughtfully as we address our programmes leads to stalled lifts and our bodies never changing.

I stole from Dan John: the answer to many of your questions is another question, what did you have for breakfast? Most people have a couple of bits of toast, some have (I'm not kidding) chicken mcnuggets. I've never seen their shopping lists, but I'm guessing Steve Reeves and John Grimek didn't have chicken mcnuggets for breakfast. If you can't even get the first meal of your day right then not much else is going to go right for you today.
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