Overtraining? CNS?

[Off Road]

Originally Posted by BendtheBar

what is very interesting to me are the guys that work very hard and never miss a workout, plan their daily PCF ratios and master supplement timing, but who take a wet noodle approach to progression of weight.

Yes, that is an interesting point. I believe that some of it comes from the crappy training advice being spread; Diet is 90% of your resuls, You must change things often to shock your muscles, and Split your training into five different days to fully hit every angle.

[Fazc]

Originally Posted by Kuytrider

But most of all, it seems as if people don't WANT to believe that attaining their goals is actually possible...

Very true, which opens up another avenue...

One of my first exposure's to lifting weights, was a lad who I knew when I was 17. He began using steroids almost immediately after he started training and blew up almost overnight. I remember him before hand, he was a sickly thin ginger lad with a liking for computer games. I did ask him briefly what made him want to go straight on and he said he didn't think weights would work for someone like him who was so skinny.

I didn't think much of it at the time, but he didn't believe from the start and that disbelief resulted in subsequent steroid use, far before anyone would consider him ready for it.

I think the BS routines open up a possible three avenues for most people;

1) Stagnation and lowered standards
2) Giving up
3) Drugs
4) Sensible routines

Due to ever increasing information exchange the fourth is one which will become more popular globally as the years go on. Or perhaps I'm just being optimistic

[BendtheBar]

Originally Posted by Off Road

Yes, that is an interesting point. I believe that some of it comes from the crappy training advice being spread; Diet is 90% of your resuls, You must change things often to shock your muscles, and Split your training into five different days to fully hit every angle.

I tend to live on the other side of the fence, but I know this is considered a controversial point of view. I believe training is 90%, and that if people are eating reasonably and training for progression, most things work out well in the long run.

But "eating reasonably" still requires they not perpetually undereat or get involved with fads or counter-productive OCD behaviors that go against common sense. Eating was once more common sense, but in this era even the young guys fear fat so much that often pull back and shun common sense.

I always ate a lot after lifting because I was really hungry. I guess I never thought about it much. I did eat frequent protein feedings, so I had a bit of bodybuilder in me, but my eating was mostly 90/10: eat 90% decent foods our mother would serve us, and 10% cookies, chips and beer.

All this is not applicable for a competitive bodybuilder off course. They have special needs. With that said, 99% of us will never compete so I don't think PCF ratios are worth the time unless you have special needs or are cutting. Mileage may vary. If it feels good, do it. I certainly don't want anyone to think if they do count PCF they are doing anything that offends me. We all have different goals and precision can pay off in spades for very specific goals.

[Fazc]

Originally Posted by BendtheBar

But "eating reasonably" still requires they not perpetually undereat or get involved with fads or counter-productive OCD behaviors that go against common sense. Eating used to be more common sense, but in this era even the young guys fear fat so much that often pull back and shun common sense.

To go along with the theme of trashing the muscle-comics, there is another trend I've noticed and actually picked up in myself somewhat as well. The reliance on protein shakes.

I've seen many cases of young guys who rely very much on protein shakes for the bulk of their nutrition. Not terribly bad at the time, but then these guys grow up. Responsibilities begin to mount up, protein powder isn't terribly expensive but the tradition of sitting down and eating with family or being able to cook for a loved one is something which gets lost. Many of these young guys tend to be a little lost without their tub of protein powder and I think that is a direct result of an over-reliance on protein powders.

When I was going to university I considered it somewhat of a skill to be able to cook, I'm glad I did as I can cook pretty well now. You don't see that often and the case could be made that a reliance on protein shakes makes it unnecessary in the short-term.

[Off Road]

Originally Posted by Fazc

sitting down and eating with family or being able to cook for a loved one is something which gets lost. Many of these young guys tend to be a little lost without their tub of protein powder and I think that is a direct result of an over-reliance on protein powders.

Excellent point. Besides, cooking and eating, especially with family, can be so much fun.

[BendtheBar]

Originally Posted by Fazc

but the tradition of sitting down and eating with family or being able to cook for a loved one is something which gets lost.

Hate to say it, but I have been here. I would always eat my own meals. I started to change this pattern years back, and now enjoy cooking with my wife and kids.

One of the joys of being human is bonding over a good meal. It's a simple pleasure, as is learning to cook for that matter.

When I was going to university I considered it somewhat of a skill to be able to cook, I'm glad I did as I can cook pretty well now. You don't see that often and the case could be made that a reliance on protein shakes makes it unnecessary in the short-term.

You also tend to see so many painfully bland meals when people do make their own food. I have joked with Ltl via email that people building muscle love to post their meal pictures on Facebook, but the meals are so god-awfully bland that it feels like a form of therapy. Like they are reassuring themselves that what they're eating is really good. 9 times out of 10 it looks horrible.

I mean no disrespect by this to bodybuilders - precision is their game. Much respect. It's just that I believe the other 99% of people are handcuffing themselves into doing things that really aren't necessary.