a discussion on "Natural".

[TitanCT]

though i dont fall into any category since i dont compete in anything, i do train with a natural world champ, i consider him a close friend, and i have the utmost respect for him. so, i definitely dont mean this to be anymore than a FRIENDLY discussion on what defines a natural athlete. Different organizations allow different things. Some allow things like 6oxo, some allow you to compete if you have a history of using PH's (as long as you have to have been off them for 2+ years). Supplements are all chemicals that were studied and put together by chemists for various reasons and uses. even food, at it's most basic form is made up of chemicals that force a body to react in different ways.


so what is your definition of a "natural" bodybuilder?
(please, keep this friendly!)

[rippednmichigan]

Originally Posted by TitanCT

though i dont fall into any category since i dont compete in anything, i do train with a natural world champ, i consider him a close friend, and i have the utmost respect for him. so, i definitely dont mean this to be anymore than a FRIENDLY discussion on what defines a natural athlete. Different organizations allow different things. Some allow things like 6oxo, some allow you to compete if you have a history of using PH's (as long as you have to have been off them for 2+ years). Supplements are all chemicals that were studied and put together by chemists for various reasons and uses. even food, at it's most basic form is made up of chemicals that force a body to react in different ways.


so what is your definition of a "natural" bodybuilder?
(please, keep this friendly!)

There are so many supplements out that due so many different things to our bodies. I spoke to one of the head officials for the michigan npc before I did my show about what was excitable. The answer I got was no one has ever failed using any thing legal or over the counter. So to me as long as your not using any thing illegal your natural. **** if you use a multi-vitamin your supplementing and no longer "NATURAL"

[TitanCT]

Originally Posted by rippednmichigan

There are so many supplements out that due so many different things to our bodies. I spoke to one of the head officials for the michigan npc before I did my show about what was excitable. The answer I got was no one has ever failed using any thing legal or over the counter. So to me as long as your not using any thing illegal your natural. **** if you use a multi-vitamin your supplementing and no longer "NATURAL"

"no one has failed using anything legal" isnt entirely true. PH's can and have caused a false positive.

[rippednmichigan]

Originally Posted by TitanCT

"no one has failed using anything legal" isnt entirely true. PH's can and have caused a false positive.

This is what he stated, I can totally see how some ph's can cause a false positive though. Now I wouldn't use any thing like SD, but I would use say Slin Shot or 11oxo.

[rippednmichigan]

Just to throw this out there I'm giving up ph's for the good's of being more "NATURAL"

[thumpinos]

The logical line for me is steroids, PHs and illegal cutting drugs like clen. I would also include the common steroid cycle supporting drugs including IGF-1, arimidex, and the like.

Test boosters, fat burners and creatine products do provide slight and important advantages, but to create a definition of natural that excluded all products except for meat and potatoes simply wouldn't work.

I think it's important to classify supplements and chemicals based on their potential to create gains in the right hands. We can't, of course, ignore legality.

[TitanCT]

liking this discussioni keep it going...





and ripped they call that being a quitter!

jk.

[rippednmichigan]

Originally Posted by TitanCT

liking this discussioni keep it going...





and ripped they call that being a quitter!

jk.

I know, I'm getting old man and i'm looking at doing ore shows and every thing I can find some what locally are natty shows.

[BendtheBar]

Anyone know what the general impact on bodily testosterone levels is for:

--A stand alone PH
--A moderate AAS cycle (Test, Dec, Dbol) with arimidex, etc.

I am wondering how dramatically a stand alone oral PH changes the test/estrogen ratio. This ratio is what a drug test looks for, is it not?

[rippednmichigan]

Originally Posted by BendtheBar

Anyone know what the general impact on bodily testosterone levels is for:

--A stand alone PH
--A moderate AAS cycle (Test, Dec, Dbol) with arimidex, etc.

I am wondering how dramatically a stand alone oral PH changes the test/estrogen ratio. This ratio is what a drug test looks for, is it not?

Its more likely going to be different for what ever compound your running Steve. I would think that there would be a huge difference in test/estro levels between say 11oxocycle and a SD cycle.