Newbie Wants a New Program

[JordanK91]

So, I've been training for about 4 months now using a 4x8 4 day split.
I have seen some nice gains but I'm looking to switch things up as I can feel myself getting fed up with the same routine.

I'm looking to get some definition and shed a few pounds of bodyfat for the next 3 months and then do a major bulk. I understand that diet is the key to this but I'm not sure if specific training will suit it?

I'm planning on trying Bill Starr's 5x5's while bulking so I'm looking for something to tie me over for now.

Jim Wendlers 5/3/1 seems pretty interesting?
What are yee're thoughts on that?

All suggestions will be taken on board.

Thanks in advance

[Fazc]

I wrote this about a year ago, I think it might be what you're looking for:

Muscle and Brawn Bodybuilding, Powerlifting and Muscle Building. – Increasing Weekly Training Volume

[Off Road]

I would...

Stick with what you are currently doing,
Rearange it so it seems fresh,
Maybe drop some volume or a lift from each day,
Maybe combine a couple of the days,
Keep your current progression going,
And add in a few days of conditioning.

In other words, don't change things, just tweak them towards your goals.

[JordanK91]

Originally Posted by Fazc

I wrote this about a year ago, I think it might be what you're looking for:

Muscle and Brawn Bodybuilding, Powerlifting and Muscle Building. – Increasing Weekly Training Volume

Thanks Fazc, I had a good read of it.. Looks super but I'm still not too familiar with including more than 1 big life per session. I know guys online here joke about people saying that but I feel it takes a lot out of me so I like to be at full strength for the big ones. I will definitely come back to this program in time tho

Originally Posted by Off Road

I would...

Stick with what you are currently doing,
Rearange it so it seems fresh,
Maybe drop some volume or a lift from each day,
Maybe combine a couple of the days,
Keep your current progression going,
And add in a few days of conditioning.

In other words, don't change things, just tweak them towards your goals.

Cheers OR,

Gonna stick to the exercises in the program but I'm gonna run a Push/Pull/Legs routine. That way I will be hitting each exercise 5 times every 3 weeks with a 5 day training per week schedule.

Anyone have any opinions on this?

[JordanK91]

So this is what I've come up with..


My Push/Pull/Legs Program

Push Workout (a)
Flat Bench Press
Incline Dumbbell Press
Military Press
Dumbbell Lateral Raises
Dumbbell Rear Delt Raises
Skull Crushers
Tripcep Extensions

Push Workout (b)
Flat Bench Press
Close Grip Bench Press
Dumbbell Shoulder Press
Behind the Neck Press
Dumbbell Lateral Raises
Dumbbell Rear Delt Raises
Tripcep Extensions

Pull Workout (a)
Deadlift
Bent Over Rows
Wide Grip Pull Ups + Lat Pull Down Burn
Dumbbell Curls
Shrugs

Pull Workout (b)
Deadlift
Dumbbell Rows
Wide Grip Pull Ups + Lat Pull Down Burn
Ez Bar Curls
Shrugs

Legs+Abs
Squats
Lunges
Front Squats
Calf Raises
Ab-work

Feel Free to pick any flaws and/or add as much info or suggestions as possible

[Off Road]

That looks like the 'typical' beginner's bodybuilding routine. I think most of the guys here have probably started on a routine very similar to that one. Most of them found that it's just not the most productive way to make progress and finally switched to something more basic. I'm not saying that routine wouldn't work for you as I don't personally know you and certainly there are some guys that will do well with it. But I think for a majority of us, that's a routine to be worked up to over the course of a few years, not a few months.

[Jamesw]

Changes things up can be as simple as adjusting your cadence, set / rep ranges, dumbbells instead of the bar etc. Simple changes can make a huge difference.

[Fazc]

Originally Posted by Off Road

Most of them found that it's just not the most productive way to make progress and finally switched to something more basic. I'm not saying that routine wouldn't work for you as I don't personally know you and certainly there are some guys that will do well with it. But I think for a majority of us, that's a routine to be worked up to over the course of a few years, not a few months.

Yeah good points.

Also if you really do want to do all of that stuff, like laterals, 2-3 types of presses etc. I really don't see why you wouldn't do it in a much more structured way, which has a time-honoured tradition. As in the 3 full body sessions per week.

This:

Flat Bench Press
Incline Dumbbell Press
Military Press
Dumbbell Lateral Raises
Dumbbell Rear Delt Raises
Skull Crushers
Tripcep Extensions

Is far too much for one session, and then you get nothing for another week. It's completely the opposite of what you need to be doing. You need less work per session but more frequently. So you split that up into:

Heavy -

Flat Bench
Tricep Extensions

Light -

Military Press
Dumbbell Lateral Raises

Medium -

Incline DB Press
Dumbbell Rear Delt Raises

You do each exercise while you're fresher, you can put more energy into it because you're not fatigued from a mass of work prior to it. Your body doesn't have to wait an entire week between growth stimulus from each exercise.

There's good reason these type of routines were/are popular with drug-free trainees.

[BendtheBar]

Originally Posted by JordanK91

I understand that diet is the key to this but I'm not sure if specific training will suit it?

Any muscle building workout. The only thing you don't want to do is train "light" when trying to lose a few pounds.

Lifting when cutting fat is no different than lifting when building muscle. The primary goal is to do everything you can to push yourself for progression, day in and day out.

Jim Wendlers 5/3/1 seems pretty interesting?

I don't think that's your best choice right now. You are better served with a program that allows you to push each week for more reps and weight. You've been making good weekly progression and I would recommend staying on that path. Wendler's periodizes and I simply don't think that's the best path for you yet.

I'm planning on trying Bill Starr's 5x5's while bulking so I'm looking for something to tie me over for now.

Are your primary goals muscle building? If so I might suggest a fullbody or upper lower with a little more exercise variation. Starr's 5x5 is certainly a great workout, but for straight muscle building a fullbody like the one Fazc recommend, or several other fullbodies or upper/lower splits might be more beneficial when helping you reach your specific goal.

First and foremost you need a progression approach, meaning you need to know how and when you will be adding weight.

Fazc presented an option. I am going to present an upper/lower option based on some of your exercises.

Upper
Bench
DB Row
Overhead press variation
Pullups/Dips Superset
Curls

Lower
Squats - 3 sets
Stiff Leg Deadlift
Lunges
Calfs
Abs

Upper
DB or Incline Bench
Barbell Row
DB or Arnold overhead press
Pullups/Dips Superset
Curls

Lower
Deadlift
Squats - 20 rep set
Leg Press
Calfs
Abs

[BendtheBar]

^ Typed that while the others were responding, so didn't see their posts.