Originally Posted by BendtheBar
Hard work is hard work is hard work. If you work your tail off you'll gain on nearly any program. The program is not the magic. People obsess about the minutiae of programming way too much.
Modern bodybuilding has become all about beating the snot out of bodyparts. It works, but that doesn't mean if 99% of these guys were born into fullbody era that they wouldn't be just as big. They would because they train hard, listen to their bodies and evolve their training.
Because it has become the norm to hit each bodypart with a lot of work, bodybuilders require more rest between training days. It's not just the muscles being demolished, but the joints, connective tissue, etc.
I guarantee if you forced them to use fullbodies they would modify these workouts in ways to get the same results. They would do what it took, with focus and intensity, and get it done.
Look at DC training...it's nothing more than a simple A/B split. It's low volume, 3 days per week, but uses rest pause to up the ante'. A lot of guys are getting huge off DC training. Is it magic? No. What DC training reveals is that if you work hard, you might not need a bazillion sets per bodypart after all - and that frequency might actually be an option.
I want to repeat...people obsess way too much about splits and the minor parts of programming that really don't matter (yet). People who are successful are dedicated, work hard, have attention to detail, modify diet and training to fit their needs, and would succeed in just about any era.
I have interviewed over 100 natural bodybuilders in the last 3-4 years and not a single one uses fullbody workouts. Why? because they are simply not in the magazines. But they are making a strong comeback on the Internet, as is basic training. Balance is being restored because there are more voices.
We as lifters need to stop thinking in terms of fullbody vs. splits and start viewing them in their proper context. Newbs need frequency, form practice and can recover more quickly because of the low relative intensity. They don't need 10 pound flyes or dumbbell laterals. They don't need to bomb, blitz and blast every muscle from every angle using every possible machine and piece of equipment in the gym. They can barely lift a dumbbell without getting DOMS, and can gain doing just about anything if they progress and eat enough. They need to build stability, learn form, and build some semblance of strength. This is just common sense.
Fundamentals and basics first. Build a base, like every other hobby and sport. Marathoners don't start running 10 miles per day. There are many variables at play here. Different recovery needs and demands for different skill levels, form levels, recovery levels, strength levels, whatever levels.
If any trainer doesn't see this, or understand this, ignore them. End of story. They have their heads in a dark hole.
I don't believe it's an either/or question. I believe that both have a time and a place, but they shouldn't be forced. We shouldn't just hop around to programs for random reasons...now I can lift X, I must do a split. Wouldn't it make more sense to base changes on current needs? I think so.
Whatever programming evolves into, it evolves into. Every advanced lifter trains different. They aren't concerned with what programming looks like on paper, nor do most arbitrarily align things for dogmatic reasons. They might stick to splits, but they are highly modified to fit individual needs.
Think...start simple, evolve based on needs.