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Old 03-09-2010, 02:55 PM   #31
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Originally Posted by BendtheBar View Post
Good post FP...the devil is in the details. It's virtually impossible to add muscle without adding some fat. In general, the more fat you are willing to add, the more you open the door to expedited muscle growth. But with this said, I don't believe we're talking about adding 50 pounds of fat to gain 3 pounds of muscle. I think it's more like...

Lifter A wants to gain 8 pounds of muscle and is willing to gain 8 pounds of fat.

Lifter B wants to gain 8 pounds of muscle but doesn't want to gain more than 2 pounds of fat.

Lifter B will probably go with a clean bulk and get there eventually. But I believe if Lifter A is genetically the same, he will get to his goal faster.
I want 20 lbs of muscle. + 20 lbs of fat = me at 110 with 30-40 lbs of it fat. Bleh. I may have to bite the bullet and just suck it up. Because of my genetics I'm not sure there's any other option.

Still...I would bet real money that because of the way my body responds that if I do it with cheeseburgers and pizza that I would put on 20 lbs of fat for every 10 of muscle - or more. I would get downright fat.
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Old 03-09-2010, 02:56 PM   #32
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CLean Bulk all the way, with a pizza and beer every now and then
^ This is exactly what I mean when I say I believe the clean vs. dirty are splitting hairs.

If a dirty bulker eats dirty 20% of the time over the course of a week, and a clean bulker pulls a binge and ends up eating 10% of their weekly calories from dirty foods, the gap isn't as wide as we try to make it.

I don't know many clean bulkers that never eat dirty foods. Almost all the natural bodybuilders I talk with eat dirty in the off-season. Women, more so then men, stick to cleaner diets in the off-season.
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Old 03-09-2010, 03:00 PM   #33
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CLean Bulk all the way, with a pizza and beer every now and then
My wife and I make a seriously good "clean" pizza. Of course it's a bbq chicken pizza...which is kinda the trick. The spicy sweetness of the bbq offsets the weirdness of the fat free cheese and it all just blends into this state of ridiculous delicious. Dunno how it would apply to regular pizza. You can get turkey pepperoni (which I've tried and it's pretty good), and you can do great turkey sausage, etc... Hmmm.
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Old 03-09-2010, 03:07 PM   #34
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My wife and I make a seriously good "clean" pizza. Of course it's a bbq chicken pizza...which is kinda the trick. The spicy sweetness of the bbq offsets the weirdness of the fat free cheese and it all just blends into this state of ridiculous delicious. Dunno how it would apply to regular pizza. You can get turkey pepperoni (which I've tried and it's pretty good), and you can do great turkey sausage, etc... Hmmm.

@ Folkprophet

I think I understand what you are saying in the post before, I went off season from fighting and got some advice from a bodybuilder. All I wanted to do while I was in school was body build and he helped me, He told me what I should eat and how much, I tried to explain that my body was different in some aspects to other's...I knew this because doing fight training certain training methods are used for certain people. Some people can eat a **** load of trash and still get in shape while only doing fight training, While other need to eat more of this or that and have to do weights, FIght training and some other crap..However, I did what he suggested and all it did was get me fat...I was like wtf...Now, I am busting my ass because I am back in fight training and the fat is falling off. It's funny, I think I am far bigger looking that I am back to the old program then when I was bulking..Bulking did me NO justice in the waist line..I still eat like a mother ****er though, sometimes 6 times a day but I eat good and I keep it REAL, I keep it ROUGH, I keep it RAW ahahah
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Old 03-09-2010, 03:15 PM   #35
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@ Folkprophet

I think I understand what you are saying in the post before, I went off season from fighting and got some advice from a bodybuilder. All I wanted to do while I was in school was body build and he helped me, He told me what I should eat and how much, I tried to explain that my body was different in some aspects to other's...I knew this because doing fight training certain training methods are used for certain people. Some people can eat a **** load of trash and still get in shape while only doing fight training, While other need to eat more of this or that and have to do weights, FIght training and some other crap..However, I did what he suggested and all it did was get me fat...I was like wtf...Now, I am busting my ass because I am back in fight training and the fat is falling off. It's funny, I think I am far bigger looking that I am back to the old program then when I was bulking..Bulking did me NO justice in the waist line..I still eat like a mother ****er though, sometimes 6 times a day but I eat good and I keep it REAL, I keep it ROUGH, I keep it RAW ahahah
Repped! Oh...wait...wrong forum. (meaning, I did add to your reputation. But saying 'repped' is so bodybuddies....)
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Old 03-09-2010, 03:18 PM   #36
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I have no idea what that means lol!

But for the sake of the forum I will pretend like I know
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Old 03-09-2010, 03:20 PM   #37
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I have no idea what that means lol!

But for the sake of the forum I will pretend like I know
Ha ha. You must not be a bb.com reject.
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Old 03-09-2010, 03:23 PM   #38
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Getting some input from a few pro bodybuilders. Here's what Pro A just emailed me. The question was (my starting height and weight):

Quote:
Do you believe a 5'10", 145 pound young guy is better served by clean bulking his way to gain 15 pounds of muscle, or should he eat 25% (or so) dirty food to speed up the process - even though he might gain a little fat?
The answer given:

Quote:
I think it should be with 90% clean food. Your body will just add muscle easier with good clean food vs processed ****. Now he should probably have a cheat meal 4 days a week or so. But still have cheat free days. if hes an EXTREME ecto he should TRY and eat 235 grams protein 300-350 carbs and 70 fat 6 meals a day then pick 4 days a week where he would eat 200 protein 200 carbs 50 fat but have one meal whatever he wants. A huge cheeserburger and fries with a shake, 4-5 slices of pizza (with chicken on it) a huge container of ice cream. if you see the trend im recommending he cheats with protein and fat rich foods with carbs thrown in as well of course.
I would mention that even though this pro advocated 10% dirty, he still recommended dirty meals 4 days a week. So I think when we look at "percentages", they are becoming somewhat arbitrary. 10% dirty for Pro A might mean 25% dirty to someone else.
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Old 03-09-2010, 03:24 PM   #39
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LMFAO! Nope, Never even been there..I have heard SO Much Sh1t about that place that I don't even care to see it...The only place I have been besides here is Illpumpyouup, But I found this place though Ripped and I love it here.
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Old 03-09-2010, 03:25 PM   #40
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Pro B answered the same question this way:

Quote:
Clean because he will lose more muscle when the comes down. Endos and mesos can retain muscle to lose day, ectos tend to lose at a 1 to 1 ratio so unless said ecto wants to stay bulked forever lean bulk is the way to go. Ectos also respond good to alternating diets, three weeks at high caloric intake and one week at around bmr. The bmr weeks let's them shed any excess fat from the three weeks at higher cals and the high cals allow slightly faster muscle gain.
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