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Old 04-13-2012, 02:22 PM   #21
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-Are you taping your thumbs before you train? It can help with discomfort and swelling.

-The snatch position sounds right. Unlike a clean, the position where you jump and shrug is right in the waist area. Can you post some videos?
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Old 04-13-2012, 02:40 PM   #22
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Definitely double check my advice, but as far as the hook-grip for Snatches, what I have learned is that because of the wider grip the wrists cannot accommodate such an awkward bend, so the pointer finger and the middle finger should have the most solid purchase of the bar, while less emphasis is placed on gripping with the ring and pinky.

You should feel that the hook of the thumb combined with the grip of the pointer and middle fingers nearly provide enough grip themselves without the help of the ring and pinky fingers.

As far as the hook-grip on Cleans... Unfortunately, I don't really understand your meaning. Is it a popping? Is it just general discomfort?

The pressure from the bar on the side of the thumb will be uncomfortable for a while, but anything beyond that should probably be corrected before it becomes a habit and an injury.
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My Training Journal 5' 8" Current BW 207 (94) lbs (kg)

20 JAN 12 at 200 (90) BW - 385/275/405 (175/125/184) SQ/B/D

29 MAY 12 at 206 (93) BW - 135/175 (61/79) SN/CJ

Last edited by tank; 04-13-2012 at 02:45 PM.
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Old 04-13-2012, 02:46 PM   #23
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Also, great work!!
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My Training Journal 5' 8" Current BW 207 (94) lbs (kg)

20 JAN 12 at 200 (90) BW - 385/275/405 (175/125/184) SQ/B/D

29 MAY 12 at 206 (93) BW - 135/175 (61/79) SN/CJ
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Old 04-13-2012, 03:54 PM   #24
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Routine is looking good, I ran 531 full body over summer last year and enjoyed it. Looking like a strong start so far.
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Old 04-13-2012, 03:57 PM   #25
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Nice work mike, love the inclusion of the olympic lifts
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Old 04-13-2012, 08:01 PM   #26
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Some very strong work mike good to be back!
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Old 04-13-2012, 11:19 PM   #27
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Thanks, Mike! you're about the 10th person to ask me about tape, so apparently I should tape up as I don't currently, just chalk. What kind of tape and what does it do? I'll definitely video Monday, heavy snatch (for me), and some lighter cleans. I'll do them front and maybe under the bar so you can see how much of my thumb I am grabbing. Thanks for the help!

Tank, my clean grip is only index and maybe FU finger on my thumb if I'm lucky and it holds! Much less my snatch grip! It's index on thumb at best! I have small thick hands which are great for ripping chicken wings, but not so good for gripping a barbell. Chalk has helped a lot, but might need some tricks to move forward.

Thanks, fellas!

JT and MAb, thanks for your support! One day I'll be as strong as you are now. Btw, you know a real buddy would fart around and wait up so I could catch up, but for you guys you'd be decrepit old waiting on me, so you're forgiven. HA! J/K! Well, not about the weight lifted.

Brute, I love getting the bar moving. Cleans got me into this whole deal. I was farting around with splits and various sets of this or that, but what I really wanted to do was clean the bar. That lead me to Bill Starr, Bill Starr lead me to this site. MAB has led me to powerlifting. And strongman is next.

It's all good. Moving iron and enjoying it. Let's just see what happens.
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Best meet lifts: Sq 150 Kg (330 lb), Bench 120 Kg (264), DL 160 (352) @89 Kg (197)
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Everything competes for recovery so more assistance is not always the best idea. miked96
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Old 04-14-2012, 01:22 AM   #28
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That sounds good, Mike.

What made you decide to do the power versions of the lifts rather than the full?

I ask because in a lecture, Tommy Kono explained that the power versions emphasize the wrong movement using too much arm because the start position requires it, as opposed to the full lifts using minimal arm. I remember you saying you were including the lifts for speed work and I was concerned that doing the power versions might have your arms a mess before too long instead of your original intent.
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My Training Journal 5' 8" Current BW 207 (94) lbs (kg)

20 JAN 12 at 200 (90) BW - 385/275/405 (175/125/184) SQ/B/D

29 MAY 12 at 206 (93) BW - 135/175 (61/79) SN/CJ

Last edited by tank; 04-14-2012 at 08:57 PM.
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Old 04-14-2012, 08:36 PM   #29
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Solid work Mike. I'll second Mike's suggestion of taping up those thumbs. Never felt as though my thumb rolled, but the tape makes the hook grip a lot more comfortable and also gives your index and middle finger some traction. As for tape, athletic tape with some stretch is usually best but also harder to come by. Past that regular 'ol athletic tape will work well enough, you'll just have to force your thumbs into that bent position to loosen up the tape after applied.

For the snatch grip. It'll be tough especially if you have small hands. Grip should open up over time as flexibility with the hook increases. Bar position with it just hanging should be at the waist line. I'd go with straps if its holding you back.
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Old 04-15-2012, 12:26 AM   #30
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Thanks, Pull! It's perhaps more of a "squishing" feeling on my thumb. It really is more disconcerting than painful. I'm not pushing weights heavy enough for any of this to be painful. I'm just thinking ahead. This is something weird I'm feeling, so I thought I'd ask.

Good tip about the tape! My mom's a nurse, so I'm hooked for whatever tape I need.

Tank, I do power cleans because I started out that way with a Bill Starr routine. I can full clean half ass decently, but I am limited as I don't have bumper plates, so I have to make the lift or it's a tense few minutes in my neighborhood gym. For me, my first pull isn't the greatest, and my third pull is horrible, but my second pull is awesome, so hang or power cleans are almost always successful, and even if not, they can be caught before crashing into the floor. Full cleans, I'd quickly be into scary territory that could cause me a mischief.

With power cleans, I can heave some decent weight without months of learning the very precise form needed for the full version. I'm never going to be an olympic lifter. I just want to generate power in the lifts I do. I think using power cleans will work for me in my goals.

Also, I have some Kono books too, and I'm not sure that's what he actually meant if indeed you are quoting him correctly. Proper power cleans, especially as I try to do them like Starr, etc. are not inherently a bad pull using arms, it's just some really strong guys can get away with pulling that way using arms instead of proper mechanics. I'm not that strong. I have to hip/shrug it or I can't lift it high enough at all.

I believe power cleans will do what want them to do for now. I'll get into full cleans properly one day when my flexibiity increases and my motivation for them is higher. But thanks for the thoughts, Buddy!
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I am Anton Zdravko Martin!

Best meet lifts: Sq 150 Kg (330 lb), Bench 120 Kg (264), DL 160 (352) @89 Kg (197)
Best gym lifts: Sq 375, Bench 280 (pause), DL 385 @205 or less
Goals: 3/4/5
Goals beyond my wildest dreams, 600 Kg raw total, 200/160/240

Hack away at anything which isn't essential. Do what you love, and do it often. Fazc.

Everything competes for recovery so more assistance is not always the best idea. miked96

Last edited by MikeM; 04-15-2012 at 12:33 AM.
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