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Old 02-23-2012, 01:08 PM   #531
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tank View Post
don't get discouraged kuyt! static holds are what i would recommend also. pullups/chinups help with grip, too, in my opinion.
Thanks mate!

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Originally Posted by JordanK91 View Post
I tried heavy barbell shrugs to get used to having that kinda weight in my hands, I found that it helped my grip too

keep at it though, sounds like your very close to getting it!
Shrugs are on the menu already

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Originally Posted by Fazc View Post
A stronger upper back will help here as well.
Yep. Deadlift incorporates everything. The stronger I get, the less grip will matter (though it still matters!)

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Originally Posted by Pull14 View Post
Some fine work either way, Kuyt.

I too have pretty poor grip strength, that or just tiny hands. Hex dumbbells holds have worked well for me as have chins/pull ups with a towel around the bar.

Things that will help immediatly: chalk, hook grip, straps (only on heaviest attempts). If grip is made more difficult with straps, I would venture to say your not using them correctly.

Keep up the good work.
It is possible that I am screwing up the wraps as they mess things up for me and that's not right.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JTurner View Post
Strong bench session, 107.5 feeling light is a good sign. Shame about the deads but you'll get it once the grip is sorted.

Static holds have helped me quite a bit at the end of deadlift sessions. I have used hook grip up to 200kg too but that takes some getting used too. I agree with Pull though on the possibility of not using them correctly. If they're just making the bar fatter and not improving grip it sounds like you're wrapping them over the bar rather than under and opposing your grip.
I agree J. I need to look into that.

Anyways, my aim for the end of 2012 is 500kg which would equate to 200kgg deads, 165kg squat and 135kg bench. Too optimistic?

Deadlift - Increase of 35kg
Squat - 32.5kg increase
Bench - 22.5kg increase

A 90kg overall increase seems a lot but when it's broken down, the above is definitely possible in 10 months. Can't let a few deadlift fails get me down. Besides, my Versa Gripps will be arriving in a few weeks
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Old 02-23-2012, 01:20 PM   #532
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Originally Posted by Kuytrider View Post
Yep. Deadlift incorporates everything. The stronger I get, the less grip will matter (though it still matters!)
What I mean is that the upper back and grip have somewhat of a symbiotic dependancy when Deadlifting. This is something I wrote a little while back which will form part of a future atticle:

Quote:
There's quite a compelling argument to support that when the grip fails it is actually an indicator of form breakdown elsewhere. Typically a follow-on effect from the upper back failing.

I know this sounds ass-backwards but hear me out. When looking at a lifters technique and deciphering where they are 'weak', the body can be quite hard to interpret. Sometimes what looks like one bodypart failing is in fact just the signal that form breakdown is occurring across the body.

The grip is a good example of this: Your grip begins to fail and the body's first response is to go into a bear hug...the shouders pitch forward, the upper back rounds, and the buck stops at the low back. The upper back failing can cause the grip to fail and the grip slipping can cause the upper back to round also.

The following is from a discussion I had on the topic some 9 years ago:

"Losing grip will tend to cause upper back rounding as the lifter attempts to regain grip. Upper back rounding itself can cause a weakened grip. i.e., both upper back rounding and grip weakening are potentially capable of causing the other.

If this is true, then losing grip is a sign that either form is breaking down, or form is about to break down. Losing grip can then be a signal to terminate the set for safety."

To tie this back in with what Steve has experienced. He may well have been a candidate for a 'relatively' weak upper back. Strengthening his upper back via the use of overload by the straps, allowing him to lift weights he might not have done without straps has improved his deadlift, without him suffering any ill-effects from the straps taking up the slack.
Your best bet would be to put a big emphasis on upper back power as well as do your static holds. I'll go so far as to say that in my experience with other trainees the upper back is usually the culprit, and NOT the grip.
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Old 02-23-2012, 03:49 PM   #533
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What I mean is that the upper back and grip have somewhat of a symbiotic dependancy when Deadlifting. This is something I wrote a little while back which will form part of a future atticle:



Your best bet would be to put a big emphasis on upper back power as well as do your static holds. I'll go so far as to say that in my experience with other trainees the upper back is usually the culprit, and NOT the grip.
That's rather interesting and I would be lying if I said I was aware of it. Thanks Prof
My program does contain lat pulldowns, shrugs, chins and BTNP's (but this concentration has only been recently, not nearly long enough to have a real effect.) Is there anything else I should add? Everything you said above does happen with a grip fail in the deadlift. Also, my grip only ever fails as I approach lockout, always past the knees.
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Old 02-23-2012, 03:51 PM   #534
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Nothing much you can add, except weight to the bar I guess. The Bent Row poundages you listed are a bit on the low side for a 170kg dl'er, so time to push that hard!

Prof. Out!
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Old 02-23-2012, 03:53 PM   #535
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Nothing much you can add, except weight to the bar I guess. The Bent Row poundages you listed are a bit on the low side for a 170kg dl'er, so time to push that hard!

Prof. Out!
Are Pendlay Rows ok for that or should I go back to the other method? Personally, I think I can definitely take Pendlay's a lot further than I have been doing. My row is extremely weak I must admit.
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Old 02-23-2012, 04:05 PM   #536
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Pendlays are pretty optimal, as are Shrugs. It's just a matter of weight now.
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Old 02-23-2012, 04:25 PM   #537
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Pendlays are pretty optimal, as are Shrugs. It's just a matter of weight now.
Thanks mate as always. One day I'll have to give you some advice

Just not on lifting weights as you know about 100000000 times more!
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Old 02-23-2012, 04:38 PM   #538
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Strong lifting in here. On the way to 3pps bench.

Lots of great talk about helping your deadlift but did anyone mention chalk? Makes a BIG difference to grip.

Lastly wearing gloves in the gym will make you weaker. FACT.



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Old 02-24-2012, 09:57 AM   #539
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Strong lifting in here. On the way to 3pps bench.

Lots of great talk about helping your deadlift but did anyone mention chalk? Makes a BIG difference to grip.

Lastly wearing gloves in the gym will make you weaker. FACT.



LtL
Thanks LtL. I'll worry about a parallel 3pps squat first!
Not allowed wear chalk in my gym mate. It's a BB special. But it is right by my house and the power rack is usually free so I'm good for now

Friday 24 February
Brief treadmill warm up because the rack was actually taken today (by someone doing curls) I kid you not. Luckily, he finished up soon after.

Rack Push Press
40x5
50x3
60x2
70x1
80x1 - Equal rack PR
Bit of a risk taking this as my baseline but I was confident and I nailed it pretty easily.

70kg: 5 x trebles - All pretty good. Getting a good body position to drive up the weight.

Anderson Squats
Man these were a slap in the nuts! Just did a few sets to see where I'm at. Not very far is the answer! Found a setting where I begin right at parallel (recorded the first set). First rep is a killer!

60x5
80x4
90x3
100x2
Left it there. 90 was fine but 100 was tough, my red went really red
As this is one of my assistance exercises, I think 90 for 3 sets of 5 is doable next week.

Weighted Dips
15kg: 3 x 7 Better than last time

Weighted decline sit up
Holding 25kg plate - 3 x 10
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Old 02-24-2012, 10:27 AM   #540
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Get some liquid chalk mate, just discreetly pour some on your hands for your heaviest sets and you'll be good to go. Just make sure to clean the bar afterwards.

Nice lifting today mate.
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