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Old 03-08-2011, 03:59 PM   #171
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Ok, I might be using a tad more yank then..You know where I can get these books on e-book for cheap?

Another question - Whats the difference between a Clean and a Power clean?

is a power clean just the first part of a snatch? thats how I have been doing it, Pull, pop shoulders and drop

But whats a clean?
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Old 03-09-2011, 04:58 AM   #172
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MMA Max View Post
Ok, I might be using a tad more yank then..You know where I can get these books on e-book for cheap?

Another question - Whats the difference between a Clean and a Power clean?

is a power clean just the first part of a snatch? thats how I have been doing it, Pull, pop shoulders and drop

But whats a clean?
Ahh yeah. In doing a pull like a powerclean, you can only exert a certain amount of force. Ideally you should be slow off the floor, then it should get faster and faster as it goes higher. Yanking it off the floor hard uses all your force early on, so all the bar has is its momentum. But if you start slow and increase force as you get higher, the bar goes faster and faster, which adds a lot of strength to your pull. If you image the amount of force you apply as an upside down pyramid. Point at the bottom is small force, as you get vertically higher you exert more force.

Kono in his says he sees Olympic lifters yanking the weights of the floor as well. He was coaching one, and got him to apply the force over the length of his pull, and it made his snatch much stronger, it was the only way he could beat his max snatch.

The Kono was book fairly pricey and I could only find a hard copy, the Starting Strength book is cheaper, but again I could only find a hard copy. Thats what I found on Amazon at least. Maybe places that distribute ebooks have it I'm not sure.

Both the powerclean and clean/squat clean you start in the same position. So your legs are in a natural position you would perform a vertical jump in, so around shoulder width. Your hands are just outside your legs. Again the lumbar and thoracic arch are in extension.

A powerclean you land in a quarter squat position like below. So the weight goes from ground, to shoulders, all the same grip distance.


A clean or sometimes called a squat clean is this when you land in a full deep squat like below (some people do go lower than this but you land in a deep squat) then you "front squat it" to standing. Thats the clean part, if your doing a clean and jerk, you then jerk the weight up overhead, but still with that narrow grip. So the weight goes from ground, to shoulders, then overhead (if you doing the jerk part) all the same grip distance



A snatch your hands are much wider apart like the image below when you do the first pull


And the bar goes from the ground in that position to a deep overhead squat position in one pull (well technically its 3 pulls) but one movement. And you land like the image below



Then you squat it out the hole.

All the time its very important to have a strong back arch, if its not strong and arched, your back acts as a sort of spring and reduces your pulling power.

The starting strength book is basically online, with the powercleaning tutorial on this link
FAQ:The Lifts - Starting Strength Wiki

His other website has videos on how to do the power snatch, which is very good, the link is below. It also has information on other fun and explosive lifts. The power snatch is very similar to a snatch, the main difference is when you catch the bar, you dont go down into a full deep squat, you land in a 1/4 squat.

Starting Strength: Resources
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Old 03-09-2011, 07:38 AM   #173
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Good post Spart. That needs to be put in the instructional videos sticky along with a few instruction videos.

Hope the training is going well. On the road and can't read as many logs as I'd like.
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Old 03-09-2011, 12:52 PM   #174
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Ok, I am power cleaning right, well not total good form so I think I need to drop the weight and clean lighter and get the form down. thank you for taking the time out to write all this for me. Mucho thanks
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Old 03-10-2011, 05:02 AM   #175
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Today I finished my first week of getting my personal training certificates!! I love it!

So far the lecturers have been amazing, they all have at least master degrees in their various fitness fields. One particular lecturer is around 45ish, he is built and fairly ripped, just standing there you can see the veins in his arms from across the room. Anyway, part of his masters thesis was a study on creatine supplementation in squash players and the results showed positive results across the board, when compared to squash players who didnt supplement it.

All the lecturers dont really believe much in supplementation, they seem to recommend caffeine, creatine as standard, and protein shakes/bars if you cant get to real food which was interesting.

There are these 3 guys that are in the course as well, they are classic bro lifters!! Reading this 7 Signs You?re Weak | Muscle and Brawn Bodybuilding, Powerlifting and Muscle Building. reminds me of them. More specifically points 5 and 6. They were behind me talking about all these crazy supplements they were taking and how much they are spending each week, and they are all around 5"10, weigh like 130lbs and are weak lol. I also got the impression they work their biceps more than their legs.

The lecturer was talking about weight training, and the advantages of it, he mentioned that it helps with fat loss, he asked why everyone thought it did, and one of those 3 guys behind me goes "its because the fat turns to muscle" and his 2 other friends agreed with him, and I died a little inside.

But apart from those guys and few others, there are some serious athletes in the course who will make good trainers, and that makes me happy!



Another interesting lecture/practical we had today was about conditioning your core, and how to target the various abdominals and lower back muscles correctly and through a full range of motion. She showed us some very interesting exercises, I could feel my entire stomach/back area working even after a few reps, I can feel DOMS in those areas already.

What was also very interesting was the same lecturer was teaching and talking about tightening your core, and putting your back into extension (so chest up sort of thing) to maintain a strong back, and related it directly to a proper squat. What was also good, is Tommy Kono and Mark Rippetoe spoke about exactly the same thing in their books on lifting. Rippetoe emphasized a lot on the chest up (thoracic arch in extention), whereas Kono focused a bit more on the stomach (core locked) and lower back (lumbar arch in extension).

What helps visualize it (this is one of the ways the lecturer spoke of it), is, you pick two points on your stomach (so just under ribs and just below belly button) once you are in the proper back position. Then squat down, and ensure that distance doesn't get shorter, if it gets shorter, your back is rounding.

Overall I am learning a lot! Two problem I can see though:-

1. Lots of this information can be missed by people, or they can think its not really important. If people have that philosophy then they will be getting people to do 1/4 squats and making them do 1000000 sets for biceps. The information they give is very good (at least this place gives good info) but the tests arent too hard which means a lot of this information gets lost on people.
2. A lot of the information we learn about applies to all people (people after general fitness to elite athletes). But its easy to apply the given information to someone who has never walked into a gym before. But when it comes to training someone to actually get strength and size, the information takes more understanding to use (which your average trainer doesnt have, most likely due to problem 1), and I think this lack of understanding on proper training is caused by this.

At least this is what I have found so far

We also learnt a lot about how the body produces ATP and the different mechanisms, as well as fat loss. I will write about that when I next update my log on the course, it was some interesting stuff



Quote:
Originally Posted by BendtheBar View Post
Good post Spart. That needs to be put in the instructional videos sticky along with a few instruction videos.

Hope the training is going well. On the road and can't read as many logs as I'd like.
Thanks!! I could probably put something together soon on it if you want!! I missed 2 weight sessions this week , bad migraines which sucked .


Quote:
Originally Posted by MMA Max View Post
Ok, I am power cleaning right, well not total good form so I think I need to drop the weight and clean lighter and get the form down. thank you for taking the time out to write all this for me. Mucho thanks
Anytime!!! If you record yourself doing it, I'm sure everyone would be happy to give you some pointers!
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Old 03-16-2011, 05:42 AM   #176
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Hey all

I injured my hip flexor on monday

My right hip flexor has been sore for a good 3 or 4 months, but nothing serious. On Monday when I was doing my warmups for squats, was my last set of warmups, I felt my right hip flexor go. I was doing squats to bellow parallel, pretty close to ATG. My knees are in line with my feet at all times.

The pain goes from the top of my leg and goes down to my knee, but most of the pain is on my upper leg near my hip.

It hurts most at the bottom of the squat movement, and gets less when I'm at the top. So it hurts when my hip joint is undergoing flexion, but the pain is not there when I perform extension of the hip, so all my pulls (deadlift and powerclean) do not hurt me at all. It also doesnt hurt when my hip joint abducts or adducts.

It affects sitting up, walking, sitting down. Also performing strikes that involve the hip flexor, which is most of them.

Been training for 5 years

I have had lower back injuries, but ever hip flexor.

I am working, my job is lots of standing.

I have not seen anyone about this

I am 22

Here is a squat video of me, this was done 3 days before unjury, but there is often some minor pain in my hip flexor.




A few notes:

I have been stretching my hip flexor, and performing bodyweight squats, back squats with just the bar and overhead squats with just the bar. My hip flexor is slightly better today, but still hurts a lot. Pain is very sharp.

I am taking this as a sign to change my routine a bit. Im going to focus on the Oly lifts, just testing out a program this week as best as I can with the hip flexor. Will make a new log soon. Just after everyones thoughts on the hip flexor thing.
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Old 03-16-2011, 05:47 AM   #177
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If the pain is sharp, get it looked at. Plain and simple mate.

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Old 03-16-2011, 05:47 AM   #178
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Hope the injury clears up buddy. Seems to be alot of the injury bug going around lately.
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Old 03-16-2011, 06:06 AM   #179
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Ahhh I think I might have to get that done Tomorrow maybe or Friday.

Do you think I should just go see a GP or go right to a physio?
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Old 03-16-2011, 06:58 AM   #180
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I would go straight to physio'. Doctors always just tell me to rest and take ibuprofen. Often don't even examine over here. Might be better in Oz but I'd still hit physio'.

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