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Old 03-01-2012, 01:31 AM   #21
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I think BtB said it best when he mentioned a light weight feeling like a PR attempt. Call it what you will; overtraining, over-reaching, under-recovered, whatever...it all boils down to needing to back off in some way and attacking it again when you're ready. The term is just a term (like Hardgainer), it's not so much about what it means but how you overcome it. No excuses!
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Old 03-01-2012, 03:30 AM   #22
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I have made great gains training six days to two days a week. No matter what your personal beliefs on the subject, I thought it was funny. Thats why I posted it! I loved the "**** you and **** your elbow"! I am going back to collect stamps.
Exactly hehe, I found it funny. It wasn't really supposed to be an instructional video to be torn apart from forums, it was a bit of fun.

In terms of over-reaching/over-training they are very different and a key point is being able to understand that and not just assume it is something to be avoided or that recovery is warranted as soon as it happens. Overtraining is not desirable in the slightest and as mentioned very hard to do, Over-reaching can be a desirable state and in mine and Btb's case is what we plan for on a weekly basis. It is that accumulated fatigue which causes a stronger adaptation.

So, no. They are very different terms and understanding that is vital to any decent level of progress in my opinion. To over-simplify the terms doesn't do any justice to what they mean and the way they can be used.
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Old 03-01-2012, 09:00 AM   #23
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Yes, overtraining and over-reaching are different things. But as I see it they are sign posts down the same road. One sign is "You Just Passed It" and the other is "Dead End". If you reach "You Just Passed It" then you just have to back up a bit. If you reach "Dead End" then you need to slam on the breaks and turn around, which results in a longer trip back to your destination.

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Old 03-01-2012, 09:23 AM   #24
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Yes, overtraining and over-reaching are different things. But as I see it they are sign posts down the same road. One sign is "You Just Passed It" and the other is "Dead End". If you reach "You Just Passed It" then you just have to back up a bit. If you reach "Dead End" then you need to slam on the breaks and turn around, which results in a longer trip back to your destination.
No, not correct and it's not a car ride either. I know that's 'your opinion' and of course, opinions are never wrong! But in this case a little more (or even just a little) experience in what you're commenting on would get you somewhere at least
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Old 03-01-2012, 09:39 AM   #25
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No, not correct and it's not a car ride either. I know that's 'your opinion' and of course, opinions are never wrong! But in this case a little more (or even just a little) experience in what you're commenting on would get you somewhere at least
And now I have no experience? Nice. I have enough experience to form an opinion, and my opinion is shared by many that have more experience than you and I put together. There are many different paths my friend. Sorry, I used a road metaphor again, forgive me.
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Old 03-01-2012, 09:57 AM   #26
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Can we all agree that the way overtraining is perceived and positioned by 99% of this industry is ridiculous?

Nearly half the time I get a young lifter on a fullbody routine an experienced lifter jumps in to tell him he'll overtrain. I think this was the spirit of the video, and simply to say we can do a lot more than we think.
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Old 03-01-2012, 09:59 AM   #27
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Nearly half the time I get a young lifter on a fullbody routine an experienced lifter jumps in to tell him he'll overtrain. I think this was the spirit of the video, and simply to say we can do a lot more than we think.
Agreed
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Old 03-01-2012, 10:05 AM   #28
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And I am going to say this put in this open because I love both of you big lugs.

You guys are playing for the same team. The stuff we talk about here - simplicity and hard work - is a common bond that brings us all to MAB.

You both are an asset to the forum and the knowledge and insight you have about achieving results is light years above what any young lifters is going to receive most anywhere else. Let's not forget this.

We might split hairs from time to time but we're on the same team. I hope you can work this out because I respect both of you like brothers, as do other members of this forum.
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Old 03-01-2012, 10:24 AM   #29
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Thanks BtB.
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Old 03-01-2012, 10:38 AM   #30
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Originally Posted by BendtheBar View Post
Can we all agree that the way overtraining is perceived and positioned by 99% of this industry is ridiculous?

Nearly half the time I get a young lifter on a fullbody routine an experienced lifter jumps in to tell him he'll overtrain. I think this was the spirit of the video, and simply to say we can do a lot more than we think.
Definitely agree. Up to probably a year or so ago I believed that overtraining was more common than it actually is (coming on here opened my eyes to more things than you could imagine). No way in hell would I attempt my current lifting rate just 12 months ago. Overtraining exists alright but clever programming will help you steer clear while still working extremely hard and getting great results.
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