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-   -   Routine help (http://www.muscleandbrawn.com/forum/showthread.php?t=9105)

Harloe 02-23-2012 10:45 PM

Routine help
 
Long story short - I cut 30lbs for wrestling, seasons over and Iv lost ALOT of strength and size.
I was doing 5/3/1 beforehand and liked it alot, but I feel like the progression is abit slow since muscle memory is gonna kick in.
Just wondering what kind of routine some of y'all would suggest, Im thinking a westside type setup or an Upper/lower split.

Stats:
Age:19
Weight:168lbs right now, will be around 190 once everything is back to normal
& all my lifts are garbage right now and I dont know my maxs.


Thanks

BendtheBar 02-24-2012 08:28 AM

Where were your lift totals at previously and about where are they now?

Harloe 02-24-2012 11:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BendtheBar (Post 219349)
Where were your lift totals at previously and about where are they now?

Before:
Squat- 315x3
Bench- 225x3
Deadlift- 350x5

Now:
Squat- 245x5
Bench-185x2 (Depressing lol)
Deadlift-285x5

I dont know what exactly my maxes were before or after but that should give you a general idea on where I was.

BendtheBar 02-24-2012 12:24 PM

Your numbers are at a pretty good place. Bench can be such a troublesome lift for many guys. Don't sweat it. You'll bring it up.

I wouldn't worry about Westside right now. We need to get you on a plan that has a good mix of progression, and that is also working in some reps to build an improvement muscle base.

There are a couple options here. If any appeal to you we can iron out specifics. Other members might have some great suggestions as well. There are 100 ways to cook an egg.

1) Use the Wendler style template, but toss out the 531 for a while and use a rep scheme that has you pushing week in and week out for a while. I have a specific suggestion if this interests you.

2) Use something like the Texas method or a similar 5x5 where you are pushing weekly for more strength.

http://muscleandbrawn.com/forums/art...as-method.html

3) Use Christy's workout approach, which basically has you lifting 2-3 times a week, but pushing for more every week.

http://muscleandbrawn.com/forums/app....html#post7636

Quote:

Day one

1. Crunch 1 x 5-20
2. Squat 2-5 x 5-15
3. Stiff-legged deadlift or back extension 1 x 10-15
4. Bench press 2-5 x 5-15
5. Pulldown, Chin, or Row 2-5 x 5-15
6. Calf raises 1 x 5-20
7. Static grip 1 x 60-90 seconds

Day two

1. Sidebend 1 x 5-15
2. Deadlift 2-5 x 5-15
3. Military press 2-5 x 5-15
4. Barbell curl 2-5 x 5-15
5. Close-grip bench press 1-3 x 5-15
6. Wrist curl 1 x 15-20
7. Reverse wrist curl 1 x 15-20

Here is the three times per week template. Recommended sets and reps are the same as the two times per week template.

Day one

1. Squat

2. Stiff-legged deadlift or back extension
3. Bench press
4. Pulldown, Chin, or Row
5. Wrist curl
6. Reverse wrist curl

Day two

1. Crunch
2. Barbell curl
3. Military press
4. Calf raises

Day three

1. Sidebend
2. Deadlift
3. Close-grip bench press
4. Static Grip 1 x 60 seconds

Off Road 02-24-2012 12:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BendtheBar (Post 219416)
1) Use the Wendler style template, but toss out the 531 for a while and use a rep scheme that has you pushing week in and week out for a while. I have a specific suggestion if this interests you.

2) Use something like the Texas method or a similar 5x5 where you are pushing weekly for more strength.

http://muscleandbrawn.com/forums/art...as-method.html

3) Use Christy's workout approach, which basically has you lifting 2-3 times a week, but pushing for more every week.

http://muscleandbrawn.com/forums/app....html#post7636

Nice. All three are solid choices.

Harloe 02-24-2012 12:55 PM

Bendthebar, whats the rep scheme you would suggest for the 5/3/1?
Before I started 5/3/1 I did the boring but big rep setup but instead of 5/3/1 for the main lift I would always just do 3 sets of 5 heavy.

BendtheBar 02-24-2012 01:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Harloe (Post 219433)
Bendthebar, whats the rep scheme you would suggest for the 5/3/1?
Before I started 5/3/1 I did the boring but big rep setup but instead of 5/3/1 for the main lift I would always just do 3 sets of 5 heavy.

I use a system called a "rep goal". This is for squats, bench press and overhead press. It works like this using 3 sets as an example. It can be performed with 4 or 5 sets as well, based upon how much volume you need per lift.

3 Set Rep Goal Structure

--Perform 3 sets of the lift.
--Rest as long as you need in between sets.
--Perform as many reps as possible on each set, stopping a set when you feel like your form is getting out of control, or if you think you might fail on the next rep.

When you can perform 20 total reps for all 3 sets (not 20 reps per set), add weight to the bar.

This allows you to push on every set, and progression is auto-regulated instead of being arbitrary. Simply stated this means you added weight when you can, and not by any other random means.

For some exercises you might want to make the 3 set "rep goal" 25 reps. Some people like slightly higher rep squats or OHP, and a slightly higher rep goal can sneak in a few more reps.

You could also do a 4 set rep goal structure, and aim for 25 or 30 total reps.

Deadlifts...Deadlifts are somewhat of a unique exercise in my opinion, and I don't like pushing them too close to failure or bad form. You can use rep goals if you like, but I would stop them at any point when you feel shady on a set.

I would use a lower rep goal for deads...say 15 for a 3 set scheme. Mileage may vary.

Let me know if this makes sense?

Harloe 02-24-2012 01:31 PM

Oh shoot I thought you meant a different method of 5/3/1. Haha
But yea it makes perfect sense. I really like the rep goal thing, what type of assistance would you suggest after the main lifts?

MVP 02-24-2012 01:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Harloe (Post 219322)
Long story short - I cut 30lbs for wrestling, seasons over and Iv lost ALOT of strength and size.
I was doing 5/3/1 beforehand and liked it alot, but I feel like the progression is abit slow since muscle memory is gonna kick in.
Just wondering what kind of routine some of y'all would suggest, Im thinking a westside type setup or an Upper/lower split.

Stats:
Age:19
Weight:168lbs right now, will be around 190 once everything is back to normal
& all my lifts are garbage right now and I dont know my maxs.


Thanks

I wouldn't go by any form of periodization at the moment. I would deload down to a really low weight, focus on form and use a progressive resistance training approach adding 5-10lbs per session like a novice would train.

With this in mind, I'd go to Mark Rippetoe's starting strength routine. Keep linear progression going until you get your lifts back up, then do 5/3/1, westside, texas method, etc. but for right now you can reactivate all the disabled motor units by progressive resistance and deloading.

BendtheBar 02-24-2012 05:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Harloe (Post 219444)
Oh shoot I thought you meant a different method of 5/3/1. Haha

No, sorry. I meant you could use the 531 structure and just change the main lifts to a more aggressive non-periodized format, if that makes sense.

Sorry for the confusion.

Quote:

But yea it makes perfect sense. I really like the rep goal thing, what type of assistance would you suggest after the main lifts?
I would add about 3 lifts per day. Something that is well rounded. Assistance work can be "rep goal" driven as well if you'd like.

Squat Day
Squats 3 to 5 sets
Leg Press or Other quad exercise
RDLs or Glute Ham Raise
Heavy Abs & Side Bends

Bench Day
Bench 3 to 5 sets
Pull Ups
Dips
DB Row

Deadlift Day
Deadlift 3 sets
Hack squats, front squats or other quad exercise
Good Morning
Heavy Abs & Side Bends

OHP Day
OHP 3 to 5 sets
Barbell Row
Close Grip Bench
Curls

You could add in stuff like calves, shoulder pre-hab, face pulls etc. There are really a myriad of ways to train like this. The general structure is something like:

Squat Day
Squats 3 to 5 sets
Quad exercise
Hamstring/Lower Back Exercise
Heavy Abs

Bench Day
Bench 3 to 5 sets
Back Exercise
Tricep Exercise


Deadlift Day
Deadlift 3 sets
Quad or Hamstring exercise
Hamstring/Lower Back Exercise
Heavy Abs

OHP Day
OHP 3 to 5 sets
Back Exercise
Tricep Exercise

I prefer to sneak back lifts in between pressing lifts just to allow for some tricep recovery. Also, many people don't do a lot of quad work when squatting. You don't need to, but I see no downside to strong as heck quads. They always helped me squat.

Westside is generally:

--Squat/Dead
--Lower Back
--Hamstring
--Heavy Abs

This works too if you don't want quads in the mix.


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