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Old 08-28-2011, 03:40 AM   #11
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Nothing to add but good luck!
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Old 08-28-2011, 04:42 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fazc View Post
So we're liking the 4 day a week split now, right?

It can be done with up to 4 days of cardio (I've done that before), in 2004 over the course of 3 months I dropped some 8kg of fat using that routine and 4 days a week of cardio. My personal preference was steady state cardio, I worked up to an hour 4 days a week on various rowers, cycles, ellipticals etc.

Just one word of caution on the 4 day split, I would have a light week every 3rd or 4th week, where you lift nothing heavier than 60-80kg or so. It's a pretty full-on routine and I found that was necessary to keep progressing.

I would still consider approaching this in 3 month blocks. That will ensure you have deadlines to meet, and deadlines generally mean that people won't short-change themselves and that they will stay focused on the goal.
Your 4 day 1RM routine is very similar to what I am doing now actually. The main difference is that I was doing 3x3, 3x5 and 5/3/1 instead of singles. I do think singles will help me a lot. I also have DL's on Wed, OHP (though I like to push press from a standing position) Thurs, Squat Sat and Bench Sun which works out well in terms of equipment available in the gym and recovery time.

I do weighted dips, leg presses, Close grip bench, chins, rows and most of the stuff you have in the program. Thing is, I was unsure what to put where but now I know! Cardio is not a problem as I have a park just minutes away which allows me to go for a jog around without risk of being hit by a car!

When it comes to singles, where should I start? With a 140kg best in Squat and DL, should I start at 5 singles @ 125kg or is that far too high? Do you do the same weight singles or ramp up (or down)? My bench best is 80kg x 10 and 85kg x 7 though I did 90kg x 3 last week with room to spare. I have a good idea of all other weights in the assistance exercises. MY OHP from a push press position best is 65kg but that was extremely easy and I know I have more to come. My clean best is 70kg.

You're totally right about deloading. I think that part of the reason I picked up a minor back injury on the deadlift (besides leaning forward like a fool just as I was trying for a PR) was tiredness. I had probably 5-6 weeks in a row where I was doing 90%+ of my best and that's not good. Over-enthusiasm/stupidity.

In terms of nutrition, i normally have 3-4 eggs (2 yolks) in an omlette with some onions/tomato. I usually have 100g of chicken/turkey and salad mid-morning. Pre-workout I mix 3 scoops of ON protein powder with 50g of oats and water, drink half before the workout and half afterward. Dinner is anything from beef/turkey/chicken and rice/potatoes/yam (and I need to add veg more often). I'll then have a tin of tuna with salad and low fat mayo and then 125g of cottage cheese before bed. I like to have cheat foods on a Saturday night and try to restrain myself from booze (this week I was at a wedding and was the first time in 2 months I had a drink and I'll have no more for another month). I occasionally eat half a King Pro50 bar but I know these ain't all that good healthwise. My weaknesses are pastries, chocolate, cheese doritos and pizza! I also have pancakes at weekends usually. ABout 2 litres of water a day, vitamin C, multivitamin and I was taking creatine but I just stopped this week.
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Old 08-28-2011, 06:00 AM   #13
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I think Madcow's 5 x 5 would be perfect for you.
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Old 08-28-2011, 06:39 AM   #14
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From this brief introduction to yourself and your posts, I think your biggest issue like most people's is consistency, diet and the wrong priorities.

Try to get away from the focus on "routines", no routine is magic and most routines you'll find here are sensible enough. You've just had a suggestion to do madcow, you have considered my 4 way split, the Reeves routine and full body routines. At the end of the day it doesn't matter. What makes these routines work is consistent hard work. Not just for a month or two, but for years at at time. Usually what seperates a large muscular weight lifter and a skinny beginner is at least 3 years of hard, consistent weight lifting.

When you are squatting 180kg for reps, you will be hard and muscular all over, when you're benching 140kg for reps you'll have a huge upper body. Whether you did that on a Full Body or on Madcow doesn't matter in the slightest. So get that out of your head, as long as they're sensible the particular routine does not matter. What matters is picking one and sticking with it.

Your diet will be the main determinant of your body composition. Again what seperates a hard, lean competitive powerlifter from a casual weight trainee who slobs around the gym is a consistent focus on diet.

The good news is that the more you do these things, the easier they become as they're ingrained into your routine.

1) So pick a routine, out of the many good ones mentioned here.
2) Focus yourself with targets and goals.
3) Promise yourself that you'll stay consistent with the plan for at least the next year, no changes, no excuses.

Last edited by Fazc; 08-28-2011 at 06:43 AM.
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Old 08-28-2011, 07:56 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fazc View Post
From this brief introduction to yourself and your posts, I think your biggest issue like most people's is consistency, diet and the wrong priorities.

Try to get away from the focus on "routines", no routine is magic and most routines you'll find here are sensible enough. You've just had a suggestion to do madcow, you have considered my 4 way split, the Reeves routine and full body routines. At the end of the day it doesn't matter. What makes these routines work is consistent hard work. Not just for a month or two, but for years at at time. Usually what seperates a large muscular weight lifter and a skinny beginner is at least 3 years of hard, consistent weight lifting.

When you are squatting 180kg for reps, you will be hard and muscular all over, when you're benching 140kg for reps you'll have a huge upper body. Whether you did that on a Full Body or on Madcow doesn't matter in the slightest. So get that out of your head, as long as they're sensible the particular routine does not matter. What matters is picking one and sticking with it.

Your diet will be the main determinant of your body composition. Again what seperates a hard, lean competitive powerlifter from a casual weight trainee who slobs around the gym is a consistent focus on diet.

The good news is that the more you do these things, the easier they become as they're ingrained into your routine.

1) So pick a routine, out of the many good ones mentioned here.
2) Focus yourself with targets and goals.
3) Promise yourself that you'll stay consistent with the plan for at least the next year, no changes, no excuses.
Good advice. That is exactly the reason I like to do the 5 x 5 every couple of years or so. I print out the spreadsheet and it tells me exacty what to do to improve. Then it's just a matter of giving 100% to hit those numbers.

X2 on the diet advice. That is the toughest part. I hit the hard yesterday at a special event and have a cookout after church today.
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Old 08-28-2011, 08:51 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fazc View Post
From this brief introduction to yourself and your posts, I think your biggest issue like most people's is consistency, diet and the wrong priorities.

Try to get away from the focus on "routines", no routine is magic and most routines you'll find here are sensible enough. You've just had a suggestion to do madcow, you have considered my 4 way split, the Reeves routine and full body routines. At the end of the day it doesn't matter. What makes these routines work is consistent hard work. Not just for a month or two, but for years at at time. Usually what seperates a large muscular weight lifter and a skinny beginner is at least 3 years of hard, consistent weight lifting.

When you are squatting 180kg for reps, you will be hard and muscular all over, when you're benching 140kg for reps you'll have a huge upper body. Whether you did that on a Full Body or on Madcow doesn't matter in the slightest. So get that out of your head, as long as they're sensible the particular routine does not matter. What matters is picking one and sticking with it.

Your diet will be the main determinant of your body composition. Again what seperates a hard, lean competitive powerlifter from a casual weight trainee who slobs around the gym is a consistent focus on diet.

The good news is that the more you do these things, the easier they become as they're ingrained into your routine.

1) So pick a routine, out of the many good ones mentioned here.
2) Focus yourself with targets and goals.
3) Promise yourself that you'll stay consistent with the plan for at least the next year, no changes, no excuses.
I think the biggest problem with those in the beginner/early intermediate stage is that we allow ourselves to get overwhelmed by the info available. As you say, 'routines' are a way to get to Point X but hard work is the only way there in reality. So we go for Routine A, do it for a month, 2 months whatever then switch up if we have a bad week or two instead of focusing and getting better with Routine A.
Less chat, more lifting. Thanks for your help
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Old 08-28-2011, 09:10 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fazc View Post
Try to get away from the focus on "routines", no routine is magic and most routines you'll find here are sensible enough. You've just had a suggestion to do madcow, you have considered my 4 way split, the Reeves routine and full body routines. At the end of the day it doesn't matter. What makes these routines work is consistent hard work. Not just for a month or two, but for years at at time. Usually what seperates a large muscular weight lifter and a skinny beginner is at least 3 years of hard, consistent weight lifting.
Quoted for importance.

That's a hard lesson to get accross to people, but it really is the truth. You HAVE to pick a routine that you believe will work so you'll put in the effort. It can't be a silly volume type, split type, pro bodybuilder type routine, but so many of the abreviated routines will work wonders. It's all about the time, effort, and consistency you put into it.
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Old 08-28-2011, 09:35 AM   #18
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It's Madcow or Starting Strength for me I have decided. I am leaning towards Starting Strength but does anyone think Madcow is a better option? I may not be a 'starter' but my lifts are still fairly low so I could be doing well with Starting Strength. I am picking one and sticking with it for a lengthy period of time. As you guys said, be consistent with everything and no excuses. You're all great help but special thanks to Faz for putting up with my daft questions and actually taking the time and effort to give me really great information. Really appreciate it.
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Old 08-28-2011, 09:53 AM   #19
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Good luck with it. I'm not too far from Leicester actually, so if I'm ever in the area I'll be sure to pop in for a lifting session!
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