Muscle and Brawn Forums

Muscle and Brawn Forums (http://www.muscleandbrawn.com/forum/index.php)
-   Powerlifting & Strength Training (http://www.muscleandbrawn.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=36)
-   -   Madcow 5x5 - Clean and Jerk instead of OHP (http://www.muscleandbrawn.com/forum/showthread.php?t=5284)

Spartigus 01-23-2011 01:51 AM

Madcow 5x5 - Clean and Jerk instead of OHP
 
Hey guys!

This is the routine I plan on using, I just have a question on it. Instead of doing OHP, can I do a clean and jerk? Or is there a way I can incorporate a clean and jerk or a snatch into this routine?

Also does anyone have a good guide to a clean and jerk or a snatch?

Monday – Heavy Day
Squat – 5 sets of 5
Bench – 5 sets of 5
Barbell Row or Powerclean – 5 sets of 5
Weighted hyperextensions - 2 sets
Weighted sit-ups - 4 sets

On Monday, the weight for each lift is increased on each set of 5, from a light warm-up to an all out set of 5. For squats, something like 135x5, 185x5, 225x5, 275x5, 315x5. The weight should be increased evenly from your first to last set. Your fifth set equals the triple from the previous Friday's workout.

Wednesday – Light Day
Squat – 4 sets of 5
Incline Bench or Overhead Press – 4 sets of 5
Deadlift – 4 sets of 5
Sit-ups - 3 sets

On light day, Squat the first 3 sets of 5 just as you did on Monday, and then do a fourth set of 5 with the weight used on the third set. An extra fifth set at this same weight can be added. Incline bench/Overhead Press and deadlifts are ramped up to a top set of five.

Friday - Medium
Squat – 4 sets of 5, 1 triple, 1 set of 8
Bench – 4 sets of 5, 1 triple, 1 set of 8
Barbell Row or Powerclean– 4 sets of 5, 1 triple, 1 set of 8 for rows
Weighted Dips - 3 sets of 5-8
Triceps Extension and Biceps Curl - 3 sets of 8 each


Thanks
Spartigus

big_swede 01-23-2011 04:27 AM

I would just add some c&j's as the first exercise on each day, good way to get fired up for the more static lifts.

Spartigus 01-23-2011 04:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by big_swede (Post 109869)
I would just add some c&j's as the first exercise on each day, good way to get fired up for the more static lifts.

Thanks mate!! Maybe 2 or 3 sets?

Or could a snatch be better because powercleans are already on 2 days.

glwanabe 01-23-2011 06:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spartigus (Post 109865)
Hey guys!

This is the routine I plan on using, I just have a question on it.

Instead of doing OHP, can I do a clean and jerk?

Or is there a way I can incorporate a clean and jerk or a snatch into this routine?

Spartigus

I would not drop OHP for cleans.

I agree with Swede's recomendation to add cleans at the beginning of the session. If I were to add PC to the session I would start at a 5x3 scheme, and use a light weight to start. Don't increase weight during the sets, just use a single weight. Do this for a few sessions to get a feel for the work.

After a couple of weeks you could start to add a little weight to the last 3 sets, and again see how you feel.


Performing power cleans is the easiest option here. Performing a snatch is exponentially more technical in the proper execution of the lift. Even performing the overhead squat aspect of the lift is hard.

Have you over done overhead squats? I really like doing them, but they will crush your ego with how little weight most people can actually use, when they first start doing them.

I really like incorporating oly lift techniques in my work.

Spartigus 01-23-2011 06:46 AM

Thanks for the input!! Yeah I will incorporate something in the beginning. I have tried doing overhead squats with just a broomstick in my hands and it HURT!

I thought maybe the snatch would be better? Because two of the days already have powercleans, and a clean and jerk is similar (apart from the jerk part). I thought a snatch would give more variety, instead of a clean and jerk?

But I think the clean and jerk will help my pressing, so I am leaning towards that.

I have been reading about the power snatch on the following link, so maybe I should do power snatch at the beginning, then progress to a normal snatch? Or should I do the normal snatch?

Starting Strength

glwanabe 01-23-2011 06:50 AM

I can't access parts of the site from work.

Have you ever done overhead squats?

Spartigus 01-23-2011 06:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by glwanabe (Post 109878)
I can't access parts of the site from work.

Have you ever done overhead squats?

I have done them with just a bar, but thats it. The link was to Mark Rippetoe coaching a snatch for a sort of hang clean position, but with the wider grip used for the snatch

big_swede 01-23-2011 06:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spartigus (Post 109870)
Thanks mate!! Maybe 2 or 3 sets?

Or could a snatch be better because powercleans are already on 2 days.

I would work my way up to the workset weight using singles or dobles, and then perform 3x3 or 5x3 at the most. Snatch is a very technical lift, and i agree with gl about the OH squat part of it - its very difficult to master without alot of practice. I mostly do the hang snatch which works fine - not getting as deep down as in the full olympic snatch, even if you can.

Spartigus 01-23-2011 07:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by big_swede (Post 109880)
I would work my way up to the workset weight using singles or dobles, and then perform 3x3 or 5x3 at the most. Snatch is a very technical lift, and i agree with gl about the OH squat part of it - its very difficult to master without alot of practice. I mostly do the hang snatch which works fine - not getting as deep down as in the full olympic snatch, even if you can.

Thanks!! I think I will try it out with just the bar, and see how it goes. Thanks for the advice guys!! Legends!

Ill give my thoughts on it in my log every session :D

Thanks again guys!

IronManlet 01-23-2011 11:08 AM

Just remember that the Clean-and-Jerk is both a pull and a push movement. Also, you will be generating most of the power from your legs and back if you do it right. An OHP is completely different.

One tip: Don't do reps with these. Even on your lighter sets you should go with full singles. Olympic lifters will tell you the same thing; it is much easier to work on technique with heavy weights that way and there is less chance of injury due to a form breakdown.


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:33 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.