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Old 05-23-2014, 10:59 AM   #1
stef56
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Default deadlift dynamit cycling VS dinausor training full bore

Hi all,

i recently read deadlift dynamite and Dinausor training, 2 great books in my opinion.
In deadlift dynamite, Andy insists on the importance of cycling: start with light weights, add weight progressively until it becomes hard to get the reps, then go back to light weight and repeat the process for a new PR.
In Dinausor Training, Brooks seems to say this approach is a waste of time, and that you'd better progressively work up to maximum weight, and then stick to that weight and try to get those next few pounds or reps for an extended period of time.

I've been working for the last monthes on a very very basic programm:
2 days a week: squat-bench-deadlift-press : 5X5 (ramping sets to a max set).
I tried "Andy's approach" with 8 sessions, cycled from a light weight to the max weight i could handle for 5 reps (5 rep max), then reset to starting weight + 5-10 pounds and worked up for the next 8 sessions, ect.

Well when i reach my previous 5 rep max, it seems to be as hard as it was in the previous cycle, and i can't go over.
Also i feel like i waste a lot of sessions where i train submaximally, and i did not experiment this so called "momentum effect".

Do you think i should stick to my 5 rep max for an extended period of time until i can get a few more reps or a few more pounds, without reseting, like advocated by Brooks Kubik ?

note that i'm a novice - low weights , but 39 old guy.
5RMs:
squat: 265 pounds
bench: 175 pounds
deadlift: 310 pounds
press: 110 pound

thank you guys
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Old 05-23-2014, 11:04 AM   #2
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those are respectable numbers, so don't sell yourself short. I generally take Kubik's approach until I feel like I am going to burn out, then drop the weight and build back up. Not sure if its optimal, but I'm looking to pull 600 this year so it sort of works.
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Old 05-23-2014, 11:33 AM   #3
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When i hit my current 5RM wall, i don't feel burned out, it's just that if i add some weight i just don't get my 5 reps unless my form terribly breaks down.
i decided i'll now try to stick to that "max weight" for a few sessions and get as more perfect reps I can, and see what happens.
...but do you see any value or "momentum effect" in reseting the weights ??
I mean everyone seems to make that the most important thing in programing and progressions: Bolton , wendler, pendlay.....those guys talk about the danger to stall if maxing all the time...

also, alongside my 5RMs, i'm 5.10 and 172 pounds (wich is light).
I don't want to "eat my way through the sticking point" or "milk it", but rather get a good Strength/weight ratio. Maybe i reached a point where my very basic and abbreviated approach is not enough to gain strenght anymore if i don't gain weight ??

thank again

STEF..
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Old 05-23-2014, 11:45 AM   #4
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You could always try micro-loading. Where is your weakest point? Off the ground, lockout, etc
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Old 05-23-2014, 12:33 PM   #5
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considering the mini weights i use, micro-loading is going to be nano-loding in my case :-) but will try to stay in hard work without reseting and add as little as possible for the next weeks.

sticking points: i do not really identify anyone for sure but say
squat: mid point
bench: bottom to mid point
deadlift: bottom and lower back (have gooe reserve in the grip and lock out)
press: mid point and technic (i started that lift lately)

i don't want to incorporate assistance exercises at the moment, i do really better by doing each major movement 2 times a week and won't have time to do more than 2 or max 3 sessions a weeks, also i feel very fresh and determined with 2, any more and i loose focus. so assistance work will be to much to do.
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Old 05-23-2014, 12:37 PM   #6
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Are you using straps for the deadlift?

Also, are you deadlifting twice a week? If so, back off to once, that can help massively
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Old 05-23-2014, 12:39 PM   #7
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I just re-read your first post. Yeah, only deadlift once a week. Your body will thank you.

Strap up on deadlifts if grip ever becomes a problem. Don't let a weak point make you weaker overall.

Assistance is a good thing. However, deep squats made me much much stronger off the floor on deadlifts.

How is your foot position? Play around with it a little, and maybe get a video so I can check the overall form.
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Old 05-23-2014, 12:41 PM   #8
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In my experience the heavy session after session beat me down. I would initially see some gains then shit out of luck. Slow progression has work best for me which there are several programs. When I say heavy though I was repping for 2-3. If your not failing maybe different. But if something isn't working friggin change it. You all ready know what the last program did (nothing) so there's nothing loss.
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Old 05-23-2014, 04:15 PM   #9
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Any time you're training for strength you need to move as explosively as possible, and create as much bar speed as possible. That will help you figure out HOW to move the bar as fast as possible, because the differences will be more obvious with lighter weights. If you just go through the motions when the weight is lighter then you won't be any stronger when the weights get heavier again, and your form won't be tight and explosive enough to move anything worthwhile.

Here's a video on the benefits of submaximal work.

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Old 05-23-2014, 06:25 PM   #10
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I am using a cycling system based on reading Brooks Kubik...Strength, Muscle and Power....
the book isn't about periodization, but he isn't against it.
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