Muscle and Brawn Forums
 

Go Back   Muscle and Brawn Forums > Training > Powerlifting & Strength Training
Mark Forums Read
Register Articles Members List Search Today's Posts

Notices

Powerlifting & Strength Training Topics related to powerlifting and strength training.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 11-06-2013, 10:12 PM   #1
Kroy
Senior Member
Brawn
Points: 850, Level: 15 Points: 850, Level: 15 Points: 850, Level: 15
Activity: 6% Activity: 6% Activity: 6%
 

Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Bergen County, NJ
Posts: 173
Training Exp: 6 yrs in 90's, 3 yrs now
Training Type: Powerlifting
Fav Exercise: Bench Press
Fav Supp: iron
Reputation: 5210
Kroy is a consistent contributorKroy is a consistent contributorKroy is a consistent contributorKroy is a consistent contributorKroy is a consistent contributorKroy is a consistent contributorKroy is a consistent contributorKroy is a consistent contributorKroy is a consistent contributorKroy is a consistent contributorKroy is a consistent contributor
Default I now bench more than I squat cause of my shoulders!

I'd appreciate any help here from anyone who's experienced a similar problem. In the last few weeks i have been hitting all sorts of PR's on my bench including paused raw lifts in the mid to high 400's and even hit a 545lbs. sling shot PR. But as my bench goes up, my shoulder and pec mobility are getting so bad I can no longer get under a squat bar, and have been limited to Manta Ray squats only. If I do force myself, my biceps and shoulder hurt real bad the next time I bench. I've tried some basic stretching but nothing seems to help. I know that mobility work is probably what I need, but since I hate doing that stuff, I'd only like to commit to something that a fellow powerlifter could recommend, since I dont want to waste my time on some crap I read on the internet. Thanks in advance for any advice.
Kroy is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Old 11-06-2013, 10:19 PM   #2
BendtheBar
Bearded Beast of Duloc
Max Brawn
Points: 1,554,481, Level: 100 Points: 1,554,481, Level: 100 Points: 1,554,481, Level: 100
Activity: 49% Activity: 49% Activity: 49%
 
BendtheBar's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 79,816
Training Exp: 20+ years
Training Type: Powerbuilding
Fav Exercise: Deadlift
Fav Supp: Butter
Reputation: 2583792
BendtheBar is one with Crom!BendtheBar is one with Crom!BendtheBar is one with Crom!BendtheBar is one with Crom!BendtheBar is one with Crom!BendtheBar is one with Crom!BendtheBar is one with Crom!BendtheBar is one with Crom!BendtheBar is one with Crom!BendtheBar is one with Crom!BendtheBar is one with Crom!
Default

I had this problem for a year. I had to get a buffalo bar to take the pressure off. My shoulders killed me because of my bulk. The buffalo bar made all the difference in the world.

It is wider and has a curve:



You can get one for $220 here:


http://www.newyorkbarbells.com/splbars1.html

I tried everything. Nothing else worked. People will tell you to stretch, but at some point that doesn't work because of your sheer bulk and/or age.

I don't think it's flexibility or mobility at all for most guys that have this issue. My back, traps and shoulders are big, and along with the extra fat, it pushes the bar back and kills my shoulders. There is such a thing as being too musclebound or fat bound for certain exercises.

Take your grip wide, and get this bar if you can. It is the best solution. I now only squat with a straight bar at meets. All the other doo dads and top squats don't work well for heavy lifters.
__________________
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Destroy That Which Destroys You

"Let bravery be thy choice, but not bravado."



Last edited by BendtheBar; 11-06-2013 at 10:25 PM.
BendtheBar is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-07-2013, 08:19 AM   #3
Kroy
Senior Member
Brawn
Points: 850, Level: 15 Points: 850, Level: 15 Points: 850, Level: 15
Activity: 6% Activity: 6% Activity: 6%
 

Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Bergen County, NJ
Posts: 173
Training Exp: 6 yrs in 90's, 3 yrs now
Training Type: Powerlifting
Fav Exercise: Bench Press
Fav Supp: iron
Reputation: 5210
Kroy is a consistent contributorKroy is a consistent contributorKroy is a consistent contributorKroy is a consistent contributorKroy is a consistent contributorKroy is a consistent contributorKroy is a consistent contributorKroy is a consistent contributorKroy is a consistent contributorKroy is a consistent contributorKroy is a consistent contributor
Default

[QUOTE=BendtheBar;424298]I had this problem for a year. I had to get a buffalo bar to take the pressure off. My shoulders killed me because of my bulk. The buffalo bar made all the difference in the world.

First off, thanks to everyone for their responses. This forum is incredible, and I wish I had found this 2 years ago when I started training again.
In regards to the Buffalo I have 2 questions:
When I realized that I was going to have to go extra wide grip on the squat, I begged my gym to order me a long squat bar from EliteFTS, which they did. But we only have a slanted squat rack and not a power rack, (which im not sure makes a difference) but when I get under the bar and get my hands wide, my arms get caught under the pegs and I cant lift off. So my question is do you think I'd have the same problem with the Buffalo bar? (And of course now my gym will give me a hard time about ordering something else, so i'll have to buy it and sneak it in. Which wont be the first time.)
The second question is, did you have a hard time in the beginning getting your B. Bar squats to transfer to your regular squats? I had worked up to mid 600 Manta Ray squats, (which I always thought were harder than regs.) and then the first time I went back to regular bar, I struggled with 405, which caused me depression and cost me a lot of money in ice cream for a week.

On a similar note to the Manta Ray issue, I've had a lot of experience with "big 3" variations, not carrying over too well in the past, which I feel is a result of misusing and misunderstanding the Westside conjugate principals, especially with beginners and intermediates. I learned my lessons the hard way, but continually see guys making the same mistakes. Im new here so im not sure if this has been addressed before, and don't want to be redundant.
I hope Im not being too long winded, but I could talk/write about powerlifting all day. Thanks again.
Kroy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-07-2013, 11:29 PM   #4
MikeM
Senior Member
Max Brawn
Points: 12,864, Level: 74 Points: 12,864, Level: 74 Points: 12,864, Level: 74
Activity: 13% Activity: 13% Activity: 13%
 
MikeM's Avatar
 

Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Richmond, VA
Posts: 3,831
Training Exp: in 3rd year
Training Type: Powerlifting
Fav Exercise: Deadlift
Fav Supp: Food
Reputation: 290547
MikeM is an elite memberMikeM is an elite memberMikeM is an elite memberMikeM is an elite memberMikeM is an elite memberMikeM is an elite memberMikeM is an elite memberMikeM is an elite memberMikeM is an elite memberMikeM is an elite memberMikeM is an elite member
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kroy View Post
[ I had worked up to mid 600 Manta Ray squats, (which I always thought were harder than regs.) and then the first time I went back to regular bar, I struggled with 405, which caused me depression and cost me a lot of money in ice cream for a week..
Haha. I completely understand that ice cream comment!!

My take is this, if you haven't royaly screwed your shoulders past the point of no return, you will benefit from mobility stuff. I love DOnnie's stuff as well mobilitywod.com. However if you are past the point of no return, then you have to make adaptations. ie buffalo bar, etc.

It depends where you are in the grand scheme of life. I have a screwed up ankle, cannot squat at all without an Olympic shoe. I have a screwed up shoulder, can't bench at all flat backed. But shoes and arched back and I'm fine.

Find what makes you able to do the movement and move forward.
__________________
I am Anton Zdravko Martin!

Best meet lifts: Sq 150 Kg (330 lb), Bench 120 Kg (264), DL 160 (352) @89 Kg (197)
Best gym lifts: Sq 375, Bench 280 (pause), DL 385 @205 or less
Goals: 3/4/5
Goals beyond my wildest dreams, 600 Kg raw total, 200/160/240

Hack away at anything which isn't essential. Do what you love, and do it often. Fazc.

Everything competes for recovery so more assistance is not always the best idea. miked96
MikeM is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-08-2013, 08:01 AM   #5
Kroy
Senior Member
Brawn
Points: 850, Level: 15 Points: 850, Level: 15 Points: 850, Level: 15
Activity: 6% Activity: 6% Activity: 6%
 

Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Bergen County, NJ
Posts: 173
Training Exp: 6 yrs in 90's, 3 yrs now
Training Type: Powerlifting
Fav Exercise: Bench Press
Fav Supp: iron
Reputation: 5210
Kroy is a consistent contributorKroy is a consistent contributorKroy is a consistent contributorKroy is a consistent contributorKroy is a consistent contributorKroy is a consistent contributorKroy is a consistent contributorKroy is a consistent contributorKroy is a consistent contributorKroy is a consistent contributorKroy is a consistent contributor
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeM View Post
Haha. I completely understand that ice cream comment!!
It depends where you are in the grand scheme of life. I have a screwed up ankle, cannot squat at all without an Olympic shoe. I have a screwed up shoulder, can't bench at all flat backed. But shoes and arched back and I'm fine.
Find what makes you able to do the movement and move forward.
I hear ya Mike, but I guess my biggest concern is competing full meet. Im ready to resign to just doing push/pull meets and hope I can rehab my shoulders back, or learn to transfer B. Bar squats into regular meet squats, as Steve said he does. It just seemed it happened overnight that I went from working on a 1600 - 1800lbs total to not wanting to squat anymore other than an assistance to DL's.
Or maybe I should just be eating more ice cream and stop my whining?!
Kroy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-06-2013, 10:21 PM   #6
Cutty
Senior Member
Max Brawn
Points: 5,647, Level: 48 Points: 5,647, Level: 48 Points: 5,647, Level: 48
Activity: 4% Activity: 4% Activity: 4%
 

Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Indiana
Posts: 2,275
Training Exp: 3.5 years
Training Type: Powerlifting
Fav Exercise: Deadlift
Fav Supp: Amino Acids
Reputation: 124748
Cutty is a master memberCutty is a master memberCutty is a master memberCutty is a master memberCutty is a master memberCutty is a master memberCutty is a master memberCutty is a master memberCutty is a master memberCutty is a master memberCutty is a master member
Default

Getting a buffalo bar like Bendthebar will give you a longer bar to get your hands on and it's curved slightly, so your shoulders don't get so far back.

I have really really tight pecs and shoulders too and I have to use a bar that part of the bar won't spin and I have to touch the plates.

I have a long piece of PCV pipe I keep using to help stretch, I'll sit here on the computer and just hold it and stretch. I haven't done it enough regularly to tell a huge difference but it isn't AS bad.

Good luck.
__________________
CuttyStrength.com

Link to log

Max Gym Lifts: 495/300/605
Last Meet Lifts: 435/303/512

Passion without discipline is just a dream. - Steve Shaw

Sometimes you make your own pull by pushing forward. - Steve Shaw
Cutty is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-06-2013, 10:48 PM   #7
CountryFriedMuscle
Senior Member
Uber Brawn
Points: 1,780, Level: 24 Points: 1,780, Level: 24 Points: 1,780, Level: 24
Activity: 3% Activity: 3% Activity: 3%
 
CountryFriedMuscle's Avatar
 

Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: VA
Posts: 471
Training Type: Strongman
Fav Exercise: Log Press
Reputation: 14383
CountryFriedMuscle is a dedicated contributorCountryFriedMuscle is a dedicated contributorCountryFriedMuscle is a dedicated contributorCountryFriedMuscle is a dedicated contributorCountryFriedMuscle is a dedicated contributorCountryFriedMuscle is a dedicated contributorCountryFriedMuscle is a dedicated contributorCountryFriedMuscle is a dedicated contributorCountryFriedMuscle is a dedicated contributorCountryFriedMuscle is a dedicated contributorCountryFriedMuscle is a dedicated contributor
Default

When this happens to me, I find that taking a lacrosse or baseball to my pecs and lats helps to open things back up. Basically mash up and stretch your internal rotators; I won't guarantee it, but I don't think it will hurt.
__________________
Best Lifts:
Squat/Bench/Deadlift (445/300/500)
Axle Press (270x4), Log Press (255x1), Farmer's (215/hand, 50 ft), Strict Press (225x1
CountryFriedMuscle is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-07-2013, 01:36 AM   #8
big_swede
Senior Member
Max Brawn
Points: 34,215, Level: 100 Points: 34,215, Level: 100 Points: 34,215, Level: 100
Activity: 62% Activity: 62% Activity: 62%
 
big_swede's Avatar
 

Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: sweden
Posts: 11,952
Training Exp: 5
Training Type: Strongman
Fav Exercise: Cable flyes
Fav Supp: Celltech
Reputation: 479119
big_swede is one with Crom!big_swede is one with Crom!big_swede is one with Crom!big_swede is one with Crom!big_swede is one with Crom!big_swede is one with Crom!big_swede is one with Crom!big_swede is one with Crom!big_swede is one with Crom!big_swede is one with Crom!big_swede is one with Crom!
Default

Not an expert but I think Donnie Thompson has some good info and advice on this matter on his youtube page.
__________________
big_swede is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-07-2013, 07:22 AM   #9
J_Byrd
Senior Member
Max Brawn
Points: 21,229, Level: 91 Points: 21,229, Level: 91 Points: 21,229, Level: 91
Activity: 28% Activity: 28% Activity: 28%
 
J_Byrd's Avatar
 

Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: St. Johns, FL
Posts: 5,841
Training Exp: 15
Training Type: Powerlifting
Fav Exercise: Squat
Reputation: 450709
J_Byrd is one with Crom!J_Byrd is one with Crom!J_Byrd is one with Crom!J_Byrd is one with Crom!J_Byrd is one with Crom!J_Byrd is one with Crom!J_Byrd is one with Crom!J_Byrd is one with Crom!J_Byrd is one with Crom!J_Byrd is one with Crom!J_Byrd is one with Crom!
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by big_swede View Post
Not an expert but I think Donnie Thompson has some good info and advice on this matter on his youtube page.
This is what I was about to say. If you cant take advice from one of the best powerlifters of all time, not sure who you would

__________________
Best meet lifts: 1040squat, 705 bench, 730 deadlift
Best total: 1040-680-730=2450
Pro Total@308

Proudly sponsored by

http://muscleandbrawn.com

http://bigworkoutplan.com/

http://www.andersonpowerlifting.com/Default.asp


"This is about strength, not getting a 10.0 form score from the Russian judge" Steve Shaw

Last edited by J_Byrd; 11-07-2013 at 07:25 AM.
J_Byrd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-07-2013, 08:24 AM   #10
Kroy
Senior Member
Brawn
Points: 850, Level: 15 Points: 850, Level: 15 Points: 850, Level: 15
Activity: 6% Activity: 6% Activity: 6%
 

Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Bergen County, NJ
Posts: 173
Training Exp: 6 yrs in 90's, 3 yrs now
Training Type: Powerlifting
Fav Exercise: Bench Press
Fav Supp: iron
Reputation: 5210
Kroy is a consistent contributorKroy is a consistent contributorKroy is a consistent contributorKroy is a consistent contributorKroy is a consistent contributorKroy is a consistent contributorKroy is a consistent contributorKroy is a consistent contributorKroy is a consistent contributorKroy is a consistent contributorKroy is a consistent contributor
Default

[QUOTE=J_Byrd;424386]This is what I was about to say. If you cant take advice from one of the best powerlifters of all time, not sure who you would

Yeah, but he squats high, and only hits big numbers cause of his gear!

(Im joking, im making fun of all the youtube a-holes that talk crap about one of the greatest lifters of all time)


Thanks. Great video. Im gonna order some bands ASAP.

Last edited by Kroy; 11-07-2013 at 08:46 AM.
Kroy is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Legs and shoulders bsprad Training Logs 3 07-23-2013 12:18 PM
Pete Rubish Squat and Bench Press Rich Knapp Video 12 11-24-2012 10:03 PM
Building up my shoulders gorillablood Muscle Building and Bodybuilding 1 04-29-2012 03:57 PM
Predicting Maximum Strength in the Bench Press, Squat and Deadlift BendtheBar Workouts 0 06-05-2011 08:50 AM
shoulders NTO Muscle Building and Bodybuilding 20 12-31-2010 07:46 PM

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:36 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.