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-   -   Longevity (http://www.muscleandbrawn.com/forum/showthread.php?t=12100)

mr_bigmuscles 01-03-2013 01:45 PM

Longevity
 
So I was reading miked96's article "Don't be 165 pound Weakling" (which hits close to home as I'm a 170 pound weakling).

This part stuck out to me:
The dissenting cry for the weak-minded is that it’s not healthy. First off, lifting weights to the extent where you would be reading this article is probably not the healthiest thing for you. Is it really good for me to squat and pull over 500 pounds three to four times a week? Is that the best thing for my knees and spine? The answer is no.
So I got to thinking, is this really true? My own knees and back have never felt better since I started lifting but I haven't been lifting long or anywhere near 500lbs.

I know plenty of retired people, otherwise healthy, who can't bodyweight squat past paralell, who have back problems, shoulder problems etc and they never lifted a day in their lives. Not trying to pick a fight with Mike here, just using his article as a jumping-off point.

1. Could some older, strong (500+ squat/pull) lifters chime in here? How's your joint and spine health?

2. Are there any studies on this? I'd be interested to see some kind of comparison between career weightlifters/strongmen/powerlifters and the general population.

BendtheBar 01-03-2013 02:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mr_bigmuscles (Post 308117)

1. Could some older, strong (500+ squat/pull) lifters chime in here? How's your joint and spine health?

Perfect.

No tendinitis, no joint issues, no knee issues.

I have had some issues over the years but have learned:

1) Less is more.
2) Stop a session when something doesn't feel normal.

By training smarter I now feel healthier than ever.

My personal opinion is that too many guys don't pay enough attention to form. Combine that with the desire to destroy themselves in the gym every day, and I think it's a dangerous recipe.

Fazc 01-03-2013 03:19 PM

I've lifted 500-600+ in various exercises for over a decade. I feel fine.

Just my opinion but form is the big killer here. Most injuries are not freak accidents which occur overnight, most are cumulative things which wear away over the years. Let's take the knee for example, you could stand there bending and straightening your knee all day without a problem, it's not the action of using the joint that's a problem. It's when you add weight and the muscles aren't able to cope with moving over the range or tracking the joint in the correct way that you have problems.

Take all the effort people put into prehab, foam rolling and all that bullshit and put it into practice on the big lifts and you would solve a lot of problems. Controversial perhaps, but I think prehab and all that stuff is bollocks, why not prevent issues in the first place. But no people would rather do prehab all week, every day to try and heal the problems they cause while exercising incorrectly and then only spend 20 minutes during the week actually practising that particular exercise. Madness.

Beverly McD 01-03-2013 03:50 PM

Any long term activity is going to cause wear and tear problems. Regardless of the
sport.

Getting older is not pain free, even if the person has never done anything but sit on the couch and eat cheeto's.

May as well go with a fight :D

Fazc 01-03-2013 03:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Beverly McD (Post 308162)
Any long term activity is going to cause wear and tear problems. Regardless of the
sport.

Getting older is not pain free, even if the person has never done anything but sit on the couch and eat cheeto's.

May as well go with a fight :D

Indeed :)

MikeM 01-03-2013 03:58 PM

That is thought provoking Fazc. Not sure I agree, but certainly something to think about.

For one thing, most people have imbalances before they ever even start lifting, and those need to be addressed, often with prehab stuff.

Also few people are pristine in their movements in real life and so come into lifting with baggage. Bad back from slouching, jacked up shoulder from throwing a football, bad knees from chasing your kids around the supermarket, whatever.

Even with perfect form, they will have issues that need to be addressed outside doing the lift itself correctly.

As for Mr. Big's point. I think Miked has a fairly valid point. You keep playing around with max weights and you are very likely to do yourself a mischief over time no matter how careful you are. I suppose you could always stay within yourself and never really go to the edge, but I don't believe Miked is addressing those type of lifters.

So, Mr. Big, the ball is in your court. If all you want is a helathy and fit lifestyle as your signature suggests, then you should be fine going forward.

If you want to see what the maximum you are capable of doing is, then you are probably dancing with the devil long term.

On another note, you could be totally safe with your lifting and get hit by a bus, or lift heavy and have a bad back when you're old. Anything is possible.

Davis 01-03-2013 05:55 PM

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I haven't lifted very long, and I'm still pretty young. So far, I don't think I've done anything that will screw me up later on. I don't know if I'll even continue to such a level where I am actively moving very heavy weights, but as said above, I may as well go out with a fight. I enjoy doing this, and I will keep doing it until I screw myself up too badly, or if/when I no longer enjoy it.

BendtheBar 01-03-2013 08:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Beverly McD (Post 308162)
Any long term activity is going to cause wear and tear problems. Regardless of the
sport.

Getting older is not pain free, even if the person has never done anything but sit on the couch and eat cheeto's.

May as well go with a fight :D

Well said.

jdmalm123 01-03-2013 09:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mr_bigmuscles (Post 308117)
My own knees and back have never felt better since I started lifting

Best answer you will get.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mr_bigmuscles (Post 308117)
I know plenty of retired people, otherwise healthy, who can't bodyweight squat past paralell, who have back problems, shoulder problems etc and they never lifted a day in their lives.

Second best answer.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mr_bigmuscles (Post 308117)
1. Could some older, strong (500+ squat/pull) lifters chime in here? How's your joint and spine health?

My story (short version)... I herniated 2 discs squatting 200# and deadlifting 275# improperly. Was disabled for a full year. Lost 25# of muscle. Had to have spine surgery to fix L5-S1 disc. After surgery, started deadlifting ZERO pounds and worked up to a 405# DL and about 355# squat. Now, my back only hurts if I DON'T lift!

Quote:

Originally Posted by mr_bigmuscles (Post 308117)
2. Are there any studies on this? I'd be interested to see some kind of comparison between career weightlifters/strongmen/powerlifters and the general population.

Plenty. All studies show that strength = health. Especially grip strength. A life of labor is a long, functional life.


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