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Old 06-07-2012, 11:03 AM   #21
DieselWeasel
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Originally Posted by Bill View Post
to say they don't help strength is absurb.....

Look at DW (i assume he is natty)..pretty ridiculous squat/pull for his weight, but then look at the world records: 672/485/714.

Can he hit those numbers being natty?

Never assume. You make an ASS out of U & ME.

Just kidding. I never used anabolic steroids, just a few andro tablets back in my Army days, around 2002 or 2003. That was shortly after the FDA ban, but I still had some left.
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Old 06-07-2012, 11:24 AM   #22
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Just tossing this out for fun...

A top natural 5'10" bodybuilder might compete at 185 pounds. Let's say for the sake of discussion he added 35 pounds of muscle over the years. Ronnie Coleman competed with at least 100 more pounds of bodyweight.

35 vs. 135 pounds.

While not 100% accurate, it does paint a reasonable picture of the difference between top natural, and top AAS bodybuilding, give or take 5 pounds.
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Old 06-07-2012, 12:45 PM   #23
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I'm no expert, but steroids are going to help you push beyond your genetic limits. Most people would have a difficult time reaching their genetic limits. I know several people on very high doses of steroids who are very weak by natural standards. Just because you're on juice doesn't mean anything is going to change. Training and diet are everything when it comes to strength, juice is only a booster if used properly.

People seem to have this misconception that roids are the reason for people's physique and strength. You can get freaky strong with or without them, just train hard and eat accordingly!
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Old 06-07-2012, 02:47 PM   #24
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Here's the thing. Will they'll pack on mass. Yes. Will they strengthen your tendons? No. Will they make your CNS more efficient? No. The work needs to get put in.
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Old 06-07-2012, 02:55 PM   #25
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If steroids help somebody put on another 30-50 lbs of size above their natural limits then they will of course be much stronger. Also, steroids will allow them to push themselves more often which translates into faster progress.

Notice I'm not saying they are "good" or "bad" or that these people don't work hard for it, only that there is a big difference. To deny that or diminish that is kind of silly.
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Old 06-07-2012, 03:13 PM   #26
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excerpt from an article by an NPC Judge/IFBB Pro on basic principles of growth...

Quote:
"A training frequency of 3 days per week (Mon, Wed, Fri) is more than enough. Numerous pros, including myself, train like this offseason for maximum growth. Even if you use streroids, you still have to train like this. steroids increase your recovery ability, but they also make you stronger at a quicker rate. The extra strength will give you the ability to train harder/tear more muscle tissue, so you will need the extra recovery that the steroids will give you."
Just because it increases recovery time, don't think people who use train more often. They usually don't.
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Old 06-07-2012, 03:17 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by TitanCT View Post
Just because it increases recovery time, don't think people who use train more often. They usually don't.
Just to throw this into the mix:

Those with high levels of anabolic support in their body's won't necessarily have to train as often as those training without support. The anabolics will help to maintain an anabolic environment throughout the week. It's those who are training without anabolic support who require the *mechanical stimulus* (i.e. training with weights) every couple of days to maintain the stimulation from weights throughout the week.
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Old 06-07-2012, 03:20 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fazc View Post
Just to throw this into the mix:

Those with high levels of anabolic support in their body's won't necessarily have to train as often as those training without support. The anabolics will help to maintain an anabolic environment throughout the week. It's those who are training without anabolic support who require the *mechanical stimulus* (i.e. training with weights) every couple of days to maintain the stimulation from weights throughout the week.
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Old 06-07-2012, 03:25 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fazc View Post
Just to throw this into the mix:

Those with high levels of anabolic support in their body's won't necessarily have to train as often as those training without support. The anabolics will help to maintain an anabolic environment throughout the week. It's those who are training without anabolic support who require the *mechanical stimulus* (i.e. training with weights) every couple of days to maintain the stimulation from weights throughout the week.
just to add...from the same article on basic growth principles for beginners.

Quote:
A muscle will not grow until it's recovered. The muscle will not begin to recover until the nervous system is recovered. It takes roughly 24hours for the nervous system to recover from a workout.

Last edited by TitanCT; 06-07-2012 at 03:28 PM.
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Old 06-07-2012, 03:28 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by TitanCT View Post
just to add...from the same article on basic growth principles.
Can't say I've ever heard of that type of connection. You know nervous system first followed by muscles. There seems to be a general consensus that 48 hours for muscular recovery on average is about right.
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