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Nutrition, Diet and Supplements Discuss nutrition, diet, cutting and weight loss. Supplement discussions as well.

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Old 02-10-2012, 06:34 PM   #11
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Old 02-10-2012, 07:22 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by BendtheBar View Post

I respectfully disagree with Tann on that point. I do not believe animals fats are to blame, but rather the move from a natural diet to a processed diet that relies heavily on processed carbs, fake foods and oils. Remove them and you'll likely see a far greater improvement in overall health.

More than this, when fat is ingested in the modern diet, a fair share of it is from less than optimal sources and fake foods - corn oil, canola, margarine.
I agree with BTB that overconsuming processed foods is unlikely to be healthful. In particular, relatively small amounts of trans-fats are now thought to contribute significantly to risk of heart disease. This is more of a problem in the US where trans-fats are used more (though I think these have to be labeled, which they aren't in the UK, at least not in a straightforward way).

I also agree that overconsuming sugary products is probably a bad idea.

However, I don't think natural = good, artificial = bad. Not everything we have eaten in the past or continue to eat is good for us simply because it hasn't been 'tampered with.'

Apologies if I'm misinterpreting this, but that seems to me the core message of the Weston A. Price foundation.
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Old 02-10-2012, 07:30 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by Tannhauser View Post
However, I don't think natural = good, artificial = bad. Not everything we have eaten in the past or continue to eat is good for us simply because it hasn't been 'tampered with.'
I'm not trying to take what you said out of context Tann, just trimming it down to what I'm replying to in particular in case you wondered. I don't disagree with this statement but run on the idea that natural has a better chance of being good for me than unnatural. Plenty of things in nature are bad for us, take poisonous mushrooms and tobacco for example. I think where a lot of people run into issues with animal fats is
1. General over consumption
2. Over consumption of them in conjunction with refined sugars and carbs
3. Consumption of fat from unhealthy animals
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Old 02-10-2012, 07:59 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by bruteforce View Post
I'm not trying to take what you said out of context Tann, just trimming it down to what I'm replying to in particular in case you wondered. I don't disagree with this statement but run on the idea that natural has a better chance of being good for me than unnatural. Plenty of things in nature are bad for us, take poisonous mushrooms and tobacco for example. I think where a lot of people run into issues with animal fats is
1. General over consumption
2. Over consumption of them in conjunction with refined sugars and carbs
3. Consumption of fat from unhealthy animals
I agree with all of those three points.

Slightly off-topic:One of my problems with the word 'natural' is that it's been misused as a marketing tactic for many years. For example, yoghurt manufacturers have long sold it as a health-promoting food and emphasised its' natural' characteristics. Yet there's no evidence yoghurt has got any special properties, other than tasting nice with fruit.
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Old 02-10-2012, 08:06 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by Tannhauser View Post
However, I don't think natural = good, artificial = bad.
I didn't say that. I said:

Quote:
the move from a natural diet to a processed diet
A natural diet is a diet consisting mostly of unprocessed foods free of known unhealthy additives. A process diet is the average diet of people I know, filled with processed crap and junk.

The point I was making, and have made several times previously in similar threads, is that there are known processed foods and additives that are not good. We all know what these are, and agree that they are bad. Sugar, white flour, high fructose corn syrup, MSG and all it's variations, etc.

These ingredients, oils and additives are extremely over-consumed by the average person. Most every family member I have over-consumes them and eats a very minimal amount of unprocessed fruits, veggies and meats.

I will stand firmly by my point...the move to a diet filled with known unhealthy processed ingredients and additives is at the root cause of most of society's modern health issues. Perhaps a handful of these are better than I suspect, but I think it's safe to say that the vast majority are utter trash.

Fritos, Coke, nuggets, mac and cheese and boxed dinners are not good for us. This is what the average person eats in my world.
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Old 02-10-2012, 08:42 PM   #16
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As an outsider who has read these debates I have to say that at times in these threads it appears we are arguing for or against a processed food diet and I am at a loss as to why. I am not trying to troll or start trouble but rather speak as honestly as I can.
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Old 02-10-2012, 08:56 PM   #17
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As an outsider who has read these debates I have to say that at times in these threads it appears we are arguing for or against a processed food diet and I am at a loss as to why. I am not trying to troll or start trouble but rather speak as honestly as I can.
I'd agree, though I'm not even sure where the aspect of processed foods even came in, since I thought the thread was primarily about animal fats.
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Old 02-10-2012, 09:08 PM   #18
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We all know what these are, and agree that they are bad. Sugar, white flour, high fructose corn syrup, MSG and all it's variations, etc.
Actually, I disagree that there is any strong evidence that MSG is harmful. High Fructose Corn Syrup I don't know anything about. Sugar - agreed.

Quote:
I will stand firmly by my point...the move to a diet filled with known unhealthy processed ingredients and additives is at the root cause of most of society's modern health issues.
And that's where we really differ, as I think that overconsumption of processed ingreddients is only one factor among many that contribute towards disease states. Though admittedly a major one in some very common disorders such as diabetes.
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Old 02-11-2012, 07:31 AM   #19
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I agree with all of those three points.

Slightly off-topic:One of my problems with the word 'natural' is that it's been misused as a marketing tactic for many years. For example, yoghurt manufacturers have long sold it as a health-promoting food and emphasised its' natural' characteristics. Yet there's no evidence yoghurt has got any special properties, other than tasting nice with fruit.
High content of probiotics for digestion, sir. But leqve out the fruit and go greek yogurt.

As far as fats. john meadows consumes high fats, including tons of whole eggs, beef, and butter. Among other tngs. The trick is his butter and beef come fro grass fed cows. He also maintains aeound 8% body fat year round, despite consuming high fat and high cholesterol foods.
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Old 02-11-2012, 08:59 AM   #20
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Tons of good info in here! Thabks for all the replys guys. But i still havent got my particular answer... to be more specific. I ate bacon and eggs. I have no doub that eggs are great. I am curious on the bacon though... some say its a health nightmare, some say its great. I even cooked my eggs in the bacon grease. Did i do my body a favor or a disservice by upping the fat content of the meal? (Excluding the fact that my bacon wasnt "grass fed"). do they even do grass fed pork? The eggs were free range, cage free
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