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Old 09-02-2011, 12:08 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by Abaddon View Post
Then I'm pretty sure she's an idiot..
I'm not so sure about that. Most people in this thread say that a person should get ~1gr of protein for every 1lb of bodyweight. For the 150lb person, that equates to 150 grams of protein. That's pretty much what the trainer recommended.

The lifter will also have to have enough calories to grow, so it makes sense to make up the difference in carbs and fat.
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Old 09-02-2011, 12:17 PM   #12
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Then I'm pretty sure she's an idiot.
I think one of the big names at another forum used to preach 150-160 max if I remember correctly.

It was usually framed with the belief that anymore is useless for muscle growth. While that very well may be true, this advice also encouraged novices with fast metabolisms to eat an immense amount of carbs.

If someone requires a lot of calories to grow, I personally believe they need to focus more on increasing fat intake while seeking a better balance between protein and carbs.

I am not a huge fan of high carb diets, but will hold back on regurgitating my dogma right now because I know most people won't go Paleo. I certainly do not follow strict Paleo year round, but try to.
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Old 09-02-2011, 12:19 PM   #13
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Not disagreeing with you Shadow, just wanted to point out that its difficult to naturally eat too much protein.
Nah its cool man, I don't mind if people disagree with me. I'm just stating what I've read in my searches for wisdom. Personally, I have never heard of anyone I know having any known repercussions, but then again, I don't personally know anyone slamming 3g/lbs a day.

And I do agree with you that it is difficult if you're doing it using whole foods. Sadly I've tried, and shoveling down a pound of chicken and a pound of beef in per day everyday isn't my ideal lifestyle.
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Old 09-02-2011, 12:24 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by Off Road View Post
I'm not so sure about that. Most people in this thread say that a person should get ~1gr of protein for every 1lb of bodyweight. For the 150lb person, that equates to 150 grams of protein. That's pretty much what the trainer recommended.

The lifter will also have to have enough calories to grow, so it makes sense to make up the difference in carbs and fat.
Yes, I retract this statement.

But if you consider the sources I've mentioned - the OP can eat up to twice as much as his trainer has recommended with no adverse effects, IMO.

None of us can say for certain that 200, 250 or 300 grams of protein per day will absolutely produce significantly more gains, but it's a good start and there's nothing to lose.

I used to be overly worried about urea and stressing my kidneys, as I have consumed too much protein in the past. But when using a variety of natural sources I have experienced no issues whatsoever.

And I still don't think the OP's trainer is more knowledgeable than the MAB community combined, so I recommend scrapping her and starting a free log here instead!
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Old 09-02-2011, 12:27 PM   #15
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I am not a huge fan of high carb diets, but will hold back on regurgitating my dogma right now because I know most people won't go Paleo. I certainly do not follow strict Paleo year round, but try to.
I'm not a fan of high carb diets either, but I'm certainly no fan of paleo. That has a lot to do with Mark Sission and Robb Wolfe exploiting misinterpreted data about insulin, and not necessarily the typical paleo meal plan.
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Old 09-02-2011, 12:30 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by GT-R View Post
I'm not a fan of high carb diets either, but I'm certainly no fan of paleo. That has a lot to do with Mark Sission and Robb Wolfe exploiting misinterpreted data about insulin, and not necessarily the typical paleo meal plan.
This is interesting. Please elaborate?
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Axle clean-press: 100 kgs (220 lbs)
Bench press: 135 kgs (298 lbs) - 1st PL meet 16th October 2011
Deadlift w/Barbell: 180 kgs (397 lbs)
Deadlift w/Hexbar: 225 kgs (496 lbs)
Farmers walk: 240 kgs (530 lbs), 50 feet
Front squat: 100 kgs (220 lbs)
Log clean-press: 100 kgs (220 lbs)
Strict OHP: 85 kgs (187 lbs) 3 reps
Tyre flip: 260 kgs (573 lbs), 100 feet
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Old 09-02-2011, 12:40 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by BendtheBar View Post
I think one of the big names at another forum used to preach 150-160 max if I remember correctly.

It was usually framed with the belief that anymore is useless for muscle growth. While that very well may be true, this advice also encouraged novices with fast metabolisms to eat an immense amount of carbs.

If someone requires a lot of calories to grow, I personally believe they need to focus more on increasing fat intake while seeking a better balance between protein and carbs.

I am not a huge fan of high carb diets, but will hold back on regurgitating my dogma right now because I know most people won't go Paleo. I certainly do not follow strict Paleo year round, but try to.
I think it was me. If I remember correctly. But it likely could have been one of several other people; this isn't an uncommon attitude. Things have changed on account of my expanded knowledge base and personal experience.

A month ago a learned friend tried to explain to me that optimum protein consumption was actually .8 - 1 gram per KILOGRAM of lean body mass... meaning someone like the OP requires no more than 68 grams of protein per day and in fact much less, if you consider that even you're average skinny 'hard gainer' is still typically +12% body fat...
*clears throat*
He was convinced of this, and so I left it alone. But I knew different.
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MY LOG

PERSONAL RECORDS
Axle clean-press: 100 kgs (220 lbs)
Bench press: 135 kgs (298 lbs) - 1st PL meet 16th October 2011
Deadlift w/Barbell: 180 kgs (397 lbs)
Deadlift w/Hexbar: 225 kgs (496 lbs)
Farmers walk: 240 kgs (530 lbs), 50 feet
Front squat: 100 kgs (220 lbs)
Log clean-press: 100 kgs (220 lbs)
Strict OHP: 85 kgs (187 lbs) 3 reps
Tyre flip: 260 kgs (573 lbs), 100 feet

Last edited by Abaddon; 09-02-2011 at 12:44 PM.
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Old 09-02-2011, 12:48 PM   #18
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This is interesting. Please elaborate?
Depends. What are you curious about?
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Old 09-02-2011, 12:54 PM   #19
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I'm not a fan of high carb diets either, but I'm certainly no fan of paleo. That has a lot to do with Mark Sission and Robb Wolfe exploiting misinterpreted data about insulin, and not necessarily the typical paleo meal plan.
Paleo has very little to do with these gentlemen. No disrespect meant but you need to do more research. This is a good place to start:

Amazon.com: Nutrition and Physical Degeneration (9780916764203): Weston A. Price, Price-Pottenger Nutrition Foundation: Books Amazon.com: Nutrition and Physical Degeneration (9780916764203): Weston A. Price, Price-Pottenger Nutrition Foundation: Books


This will help you as well:

Amazon Amazon


Your opinion is constructed by looking through a very limited lens. Both of these books present an unbiased look into nutrition and health.

For the record, insulin levels are a very minor aspect of Paleo eating.
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Last edited by BendtheBar; 09-02-2011 at 01:01 PM.
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Old 09-02-2011, 01:02 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by BendtheBar View Post
No disrespect meant but you need to do more research. This is a good place to start:

Amazon.com: Nutrition and Physical Degeneration (9780916764203): Weston A. Price, Price-Pottenger Nutrition Foundation: Books


This will help you as well:

Amazon.com: Good Calories, Bad Calories: Fats, Carbs, and the Controversial Science of Diet and Health (Vintage) (9781400033461): Gary Taubes: Books


Your opinion is constructed by looking through a very limited lens. Both of these books present an unbiased look into nutrition and health.

For the record, insulin levels are a very minor aspect of Paleo eating.
This is why I don't do paleo debates; it causes bad vibes between people that I otherwise get along with. I know who Gary Taubes is and what he's about, and I can assure you I will not be buying a book written by him. I know more about this topic than I lead others to believe, and its because I've walked down this path too many times. I typically stay out of these conversations these days.

I'll just say this; my opinions on the matter are similarly structured to those of Alan Aragon and Lyle McDonald.
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