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Nutrition, Diet and Supplements Discuss nutrition, diet, cutting and weight loss. Supplement discussions as well.

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Old 03-08-2013, 02:34 AM   #11
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I like bacon. I like exercise. Therefore, if I eat bacon and I exercise, I will not be at any risk.
I'm not sure I follow. I like sex too, btw.
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Old 03-08-2013, 03:55 AM   #12
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it is all scare tactic's by the government, i eat bacon and sausage's i don't like processed ham and i don't drink or smoke and lift weights 3-4 times a week so i believe i am pretty healthy and my last doctors check up said i was as well, if you are heavy smoker or drinker or both and have a shit diet with no exercise then to me that it is a recipe for disaster, i just cant see how 3 processed sausages and 2 strips of bacon a day would kill a healthy person i eat allot more then that, if i listened to the government of what i should eat or not to eat i would be eating fook all, lol.
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Old 03-08-2013, 10:06 AM   #13
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Old 03-08-2013, 10:06 AM   #14
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lol is this true ?
I'm sure it is. I imagine folks that read books are also more health aware.
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Old 03-08-2013, 10:33 AM   #15
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I replaced my grain habit with bacon, ham, lots of sausage and Shazam my lipds and LDL went through the floor.

Seems I am at less risk now.
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Old 03-08-2013, 12:04 PM   #16
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People who read books live longer.
Be careful applying what you read in health books. You might die of a misprint.

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Old 03-08-2013, 12:22 PM   #17
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it is all scare tactic's by the government, i eat bacon and sausage's i don't like processed ham and i don't drink or smoke and lift weights 3-4 times a week so i believe i am pretty healthy and my last doctors check up said i was as well, if you are heavy smoker or drinker or both and have a shit diet with no exercise then to me that it is a recipe for disaster, i just cant see how 3 processed sausages and 2 strips of bacon a day would kill a healthy person i eat allot more then that, if i listened to the government of what i should eat or not to eat i would be eating fook all, lol.
Oops, just repped you for your post when I meant to quote.

OK, first off, this is a study conducted at the University of Zurich. It only backs up what the government has been saying for ages. So the main element of the story is actually nothing to do with what the government is saying.

Secondly, how is it scare-mongering? It's not saying that if you eat bacon you're going to die. It suggests instead that your risk of premature death rises, and gives you a best estimate on that.

Thirdly, if you're eating bacon and you're currently healthy, good for you. Your risk is obviously going to be affected by many, many factors. But knowledge is power, right? So you're no worse off knowing that on average there is a risk independent of exercise associated with eating a lot of processed meat.

Fourthly, if you listened to the government about what you should eat, you wouldn't be eating fook all, you'd be eating a basically Mediterrenean diet, with loads of fresh veg, oily fish and a smaller amount of red meat.

You can't see how three sausages a day can kill you - well, sixty years ago, people said exactly the same thing about smoking.

Of course, you could say a life without bacon and sausage might not be worth living anyway
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Old 03-08-2013, 12:27 PM   #18
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I replaced my grain habit with bacon, ham, lots of sausage and Shazam my lipds and LDL went through the floor.

Seems I am at less risk now.
Although I think I remember you saying that you changed other factors as well? Or maybe I misremembered that? Anyway, seriously, that's fantastic if you can eat that food and your blood work looks better. Good luck to you.

But I think it's worth remembering that blood work is only one indicator of health and not the last word in premature death. Also - it's not just deaths from cardiovascular events - processed meat is associated with greater bowel cancer too, at least that's where the evidence seems to be pointing.
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Old 03-08-2013, 12:45 PM   #19
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That's interesting, and he makes some very good points. Just some thoughts:

1) He criticises epidemiological studies as having low standards of evidence. However, there is a trade off in science between control of variables and ecological validity (how much you can trust the results in a real world setting). So you can have very controlled studies of nutritional variables, but they tend to lack real world relevance. Many nutritional effects that seem to matter in small sample size studies actually have very little bearing in real-life mortality.

2) He happily cites obesity as having a major effect on health, but to my mind this comes from exactly the same sort of evidence that he's criticising when it comes down to processed meats.

3) He is calling it a sensationalised scare story in the media. Well, I haven't seen the US coverage, but the BBC story seems pretty measured to me. It reports what it says pretty straightforwardly.

4) He's claiming that there is no attempt to control for variables, but I think this was actually a feature of the analysis - though I don't know much about how this works.

5) There seems to be a whiff of that 'so long as I train hard nothing can hurt me' viewpoint.

Like the overall tone of the blog though, and that the overall conclusion that it might be a good idea to moderate consumption of processed meats.
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Old 03-08-2013, 12:51 PM   #20
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I'm not sure I follow. I like sex too, btw.
Mike, I was trying to satirise that type of thinking.

I'm saying that we believe those things that we want to, and which are most convenient for us. Evidence doesn't enter into it. We start with the conclusion we want and work backwards from there.

As a weightlifting forum, we like bacon and lifting heavy things up. Therefore, those things must be good. Weightlifting is the magic shield that protects us against other health choices. Attempts to restrict meat intake is the government interfering. And so on.

I'm not painting myself as any better. I do exactly the same thing all the time. It's just a feature of human nature that when there's something that we don't like to hear, we stick our fingers in our ears until it goes away.
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