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Old 12-11-2010, 10:22 AM   #131
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Default Deadlifting aproach.

This is Reeves intermediate routine. Look at his deadlift set rep scheme. It runs counter to what we normally assosiate as a deadlift scheme.

Another thought also comes to mind. In the Bulgarian weightlifting thread, the bulgarian coach talks about not doing heavy singles deadlifts as part of their training, because it taxes the CNS to a point where high frequency training is disrupted by the stress.

The athletes could easily pull deadlifts well in excess of the max lift numbers, and what purpose would that serve in the long run? They could never do that much in there lift, and it disrupts recovery.

Question

Do you think that lower weight deadlifts performed for reps as any other movement is done are useful?

Why or why not.





Steve Reeves’ Intermediate Routine!
Exercise Sets Reps
Dumbbell Swings (warm-ups) 3 15-20
1. Upright Rowing 3 8-12
2. Bench Press 3 8-12
3. One-Arm Dumbbell Rows 3 8-12
4. Dumbbell Laterals/Flyes 3 8-12
5. Incline Press 3 8-12
6. Triceps Pushdown 3 8-12
7. Barbell Curls 3 8-12
8. Seated Dumbbell Curls 3 8-12
9. Regular Squats 3 8-12
(superset with following exercise)
10. Light Barbell Pullovers 3 8-12
11. Breathing Squats 1 20
(superset with following exercise)
12. Breathing Pullovers 1 20
13. Deadlifts 2 8-12
14. Good Mornings 2 8-12

Last edited by glwanabe; 12-11-2010 at 10:29 AM.
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Old 12-11-2010, 10:32 AM   #132
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Question

Do you think that lower weight deadlifts performed for reps as any other movement is done are useful?

Why or why not.
I think sets of 5+ are great for back development. I only receive upper back soreness from sets of 5+, and then the soreness is usually intense.

I think that deadlifts are viable up to 20 reps as long as you stop when your form is going to pot.

I tend to avoid listing deadlift reps above the 5-8 range for beginners because I would rather have them practicing the lift and it's form than going balls out 8-12 or beyond and not knowing when they should shut things down because of form.

When a beginner understands form, and when that form is deteriorating during a set, I think they can easily do 8-12 or 8-20.
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Last edited by BendtheBar; 12-11-2010 at 05:35 PM.
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Old 12-11-2010, 10:35 AM   #133
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Well said BTB. I get all kinds of sloppy with high end reps with heavy weight.
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Old 12-11-2010, 10:44 AM   #134
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I think sets of 5+ are great for back development. I only receive upper back soreness from sets of 5+, and then the soreness is usually intense.

I think that deadlifts are viable up to 20 reps as long as you stop when your form is going to pot.

I tend to avoid listing deadlift reps in the 5-8 range for beginners because I would rather have them practicing the lift and it's form than going balls out 8-12 or beyond and not knowing when they should shut things down because of form.

When a beginner understands form, and when that form is deteriorating during a set, I think they can easily do 8-12 or 8-20.
I would agree, and add that it depends on the trainee's goals. If they just wanna be stronger, low reps fo sho. If they have physique goals especially in terms of definition, high reps at least sometimes. Chuck Sipes deadlift routine looks retarded crazy, especially in an age where standard deadlifting is generally avoided by bodybuilders: Regular Deadlift 2 sets of 8 reps, 2x6, 2x4, 2x2, 2x1.
Rack Deadlift from below knees 6x4. Use the same position as for your regular deadlift at this height.
Deadlift Holds 6 sets of 1 minute each.
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Old 12-11-2010, 10:46 AM   #135
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I think sets of 5+ are great for back development. I only receive upper back soreness from sets of 5+, and then the soreness is usually intense. I think that deadlifts are viable up to 20 reps as long as you stop when your form is going to pot.
I agree with this, and this leads me to think again about the Bulgarians and how they train.

While they are not doing Deadlifts perse', they are doing a lot of the same type of pulling movement, and hitting all of the same muscles.

My own personal experience has been that. Going too heavy really hits my lower back more rather than an all around back movement. I've had better success keeping weights a little lighter and pulling more reps.



Quote:
I tend to avoid listing deadlift reps in the 5-8 range for beginners because I would rather have them practicing the lift and it's form than going balls out 8-12 or beyond and not knowing when they should shut things down because of form.
Good point, and I would add that while the deadlift can be one of the most beneficial moves for overall body development, it can also hurt you faster if you don't pay attention to the points you mentioned.

I think the move needs to be given time so your back can adjust to the stress and develop the musculature needed to pull efficiently.



Quote:
When a beginner understands form, and when that form is deteriorating during a set, I think they can easily do 8-12 or 8-20.
Key point.
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Old 12-11-2010, 10:49 AM   #136
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When a beginner understands form, and when that form is deteriorating during a set, I think they can easily do 8-12 or 8-20.
Great Quote!
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Old 12-11-2010, 05:35 PM   #137
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I tend to avoid listing deadlift reps above the 5-8 range for beginners because
^ Made a correction...
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Old 12-13-2010, 08:00 AM   #138
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I have some more to add to this post.

The Steve Reeves Ideal Body Measurement

1. Height To Weight Chart For Building A Classic Physique:

Reeves believed ones height represented the limit to which they could pack on mass. His main philosophy proposed keeping muscular bodyweight within acceptable limits to prevent the distortion of ones natural symmetry.


Height Weight
5'5" 160lbs
5'6" 165lbs
5'7" 170lbs
5'8" 175lbs
5'9" 180lbs
5'10" 185lbs
5'11" 190lbs
6'0" 200lbs
6'1" 210lbs
6'2" 220lbs
6'3" 230lbs
6'4" 240lbs
6'5" 250lbs


2. Muscle To Bone Ratios For Building The Classic Physique:

To create the kind of ultra-symmetrical physique displayed by Reeves - where the all-important bone to muscle ratio conveys an illusion of greater size, while not detracting from overall aesthetics - use the following table, one that he himself endorsed.


Steve Reeves Ultra-Symmetrical Physique Ratios
Arm size = 252% of Wrist size
Calf size = 192% of Ankle size
Neck Size = 79% of Head size
Chest Size = 148% of Pelvis size
Waist size = 86% of Pelvis size
Thigh size = 175% of Knee size

For example: to determine your arm size, measure your wrist. Then multiply this measurement by 2.52 to get your proposed arm size.

As well as insisting on having an equal bicep, neck and calf measurement, Reeves also felt that the thigh measurement should be exactly half that of the chest circumference, and the waist should be twice that of the neck.

For the record, Steve Reeves measurement were:

Arms: 18.5
Calves: 18.5
Neck: 18.5
Thighs: 27
Chest: 54
Waist: 30

Aside from his waist measuring six inches less than twice the circumference of his neck, he almost reached his own ideal of the perfect physique.

Last edited by glwanabe; 12-13-2010 at 08:28 AM.
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Old 12-13-2010, 08:26 AM   #139
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The height and weight charts present very reasonable muscularity goals.

Quote:
Height Weight
5'10" 185lbs
His arm guide is spot on as well.

Funny what a difference of decades does to expectations.
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Old 12-13-2010, 11:41 AM   #140
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There is a nice calculator on Casey Butt's website, for those of us who were psych majors and not real good with the math.
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