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Old 09-13-2009, 09:34 AM   #31
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Any aging gymnasts have joint issues/shoulder issues from this type of training? Just wondering how brutal it is?
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Old 09-13-2009, 10:47 AM   #32
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Brutal is relative to your own body, but I've seen videos of very old gymnast still doing this. Plus you don't just jump into high difficulty positions. You have to build strength, and step in difficulty.

My personal expression comes from the total upper body compound nature of
these moves. It is hard, but in a different way than traditional barbell work.

Imagine doing barbell rows, but instead of pulling the bar up to you, your pulling yourself to the bar. So your not only rowing your bodyweight, but holding your body parallel to the floor. Thats a lot of strength required just to hold your body in the static position, then you pull yourself to the bar.

The rings are so hard because they are not steady. I was able to do 15+ regular dips when I recieved my rings, but I could only do about 5 ring dips.
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Old 09-13-2009, 11:14 AM   #33
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EAT!

SLEEP!

Squat, Bench, Deadlift, Shoulder Press, Core.

You'll grow I promise
I agree with all of this, but it's my opinion that Pull-ups are a staple as well.
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Old 09-13-2009, 11:21 AM   #34
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I agree with all of this, but it's my opinion that Pull-ups are a staple as well.
Pullups are effective, if you can do them. So are dips.

glwanabe...Would you say that this kind of work may be harder on the joints over the long haul then weight training?
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Old 09-13-2009, 12:02 PM   #35
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Let me research a bit, and see if I can come up with anything besides my own experience. There are other people with way more time in the field.

However, my own belief right now is that with proper care you could do this style of training at a fitness level for a lifetime. Depending on your own body, and whatever else you may have done to damage it. At my current age with having been fairly active my whole life, I noticed a new strain, but not pain.

Keep in mind that while I had gotten a lot stronger from this. I was still just barely doing mostly beginner level strength moves. I could hold a tuck planche on low bars, or paralettes for about 10-15 seconds. I could do a tuck front lever hanging from a high bar, and do 1-2 pulls to the bar. I had worked up to 10+ dips on the rings, and various other holds. These are minimal strength accomplishments, compared to an elite gymnast.

This thought came to mind as I was working hard one day to hold a tuck planche position. The compound nature of a planche, makes any barbell compound move an isolation by comparison.
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Old 09-13-2009, 12:09 PM   #36
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Pullups are effective, if you can do them. So are dips.
Concur. When I got back to lifting I could barely do 1, chin. Dips felt like they were going to tear my shoulders apart. I do sets of them now. You just have to do them, to get stonger at them.
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Old 09-14-2009, 09:01 AM   #37
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Concur. When I got back to lifting I could barely do 1, chin. Dips felt like they were going to tear my shoulders apart. I do sets of them now. You just have to do them, to get stonger at them.
That brings up an important point...if an exercise feels uncomfortable, don't do them. No need to risk injury. I avoid pullups because they tend to contribute to elbow tendinitis for me. Granted, I couldn't do them now if I wanted to, but I could still do negative pullups.

And regarding longevity and joint health, I'm sure it's like straight weight training...as long as proper form is used, joint health remains good.
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Old 09-14-2009, 10:19 AM   #38
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That brings up an important point...if an exercise feels uncomfortable, don't do them. No need to risk injury.

And regarding longevity and joint health, I'm sure it's like straight weight training...as long as proper form is used, joint health remains good.
I should have included that it took a few weeks of stretching, and increasing my range of motion through my shoulders to be able to do dips.

I've done lots of damage to my body. Some stories are cool, some, not so much. I have to work around several delicate areas, and just go easy at times.

Leg training has to be watched so as to not aggravate knee injuries, from skydiving accidents. (cool story catagory)

Gotta watch out for my left wrist from nearly breaking my hand off a few yrs ago. (uncool, fell down roller skating) I guess the titanium plate and 5 screws is kinda cool.

Some people tell me I'm getting old, and need to act my age. I thought I was.
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Old 09-14-2009, 01:41 PM   #39
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glwanabe:
I have been reading your approach and it is a very different perspective than most on this sight, I find it very interesting.

But, what are your specific training goals? Just curious.

Also wondering if you are going to run a log, I would enjoy following such a different training approach.

My approach is the same as bwys, the conjugate method, lifting heavy one day and speed the other to generate maximum force and never get bored by switching things up constantly. Eat big, get big.
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Old 09-14-2009, 04:26 PM   #40
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Default My specific goals

Stay healthy so I can lead an active life.
Increase my strength as much as I can.
Put 20 yr olds to shame when I'm 60.
HAVE FUN working out!


I've done the regular bodybuilding work in the past, and enjoyed it. I still enjoy it! I like pushing more this time than I did last time. I pushed hard in the past to get my bench up over 200lbs. I've hit 230 for reps using traditional workouts. However, I blew past that point and pushed 240 without benching doing a different approach.

The more I learn about exercising, the more I learn that there are lots of ways to build strength, and or size. For myself right now, strength is more important than pure size. I want to be as strong as I look.

I also like to challenge myself, and constantly strive to learn new things in my life. I was at Dragondoor and read the article from Chris Sommer about gymnastic strength training. I had done some gymnastics back in high school, and enjoyed it. I always liked the look of a built gymnast physique. So I dug into the website, and ordered up some rings. I nagged my buddy until he came over one day, and I showed him what I was up to. He was hooked.

Timmy ordered up the same stuff I had, and bought a lat tower like mine to hang his rings from, and we started working. Tim also built some mini parallel bars for each of us. We carpool, and would work at each others houses right after work.

We could see changes happening, and the basic gymnast uppr body were showing. When we blew past our previous PB in benching, without having done it,

We were not getting as much leg work as we wanted, and I wanted to get back to squats as well. I had previously tried a little Oly lifting as a basic workout, and liked the heavy lower body emphasis. Now, if I could merge an Oly lifters lower body strength with a gymnast upper body, thats what I wanted to do. Other people also had the same idea. For general fitness it's good. The two sports don't really overlap very well though from a actual athletes perspective.

For the last three months I've been mainly working out using an Oly lifters style program. I have also kept up some other upperbody work as well. I've looked at how the Chinese, Bulgarians, and other OLY teams train.

The big thing that stuck out with these programs was that I was training 5 days in a row. cont.

Last edited by glwanabe; 09-14-2009 at 04:35 PM.
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