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Muscle Building and Bodybuilding Topics related to muscle building, bodybuilding, including training and fullbody workouts. If you are looking for great advice on gaining muscle this forum is for you.

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Old 06-24-2013, 06:35 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by Off Road View Post
Brooks says it better than I can. . .

"Beginners should start with very light weights, and perform one set of each exercise. The workouts should be fast, fun and easy. There's no need to strain and struggle.

Don't train every day. Train three times a week, with a day of rest between every workout. Mon/Wed/Fri works perfectly. So does Tues/Thurs/Sat.
..."

- Brooks Kubik
Yep, that's pretty much what I did, initially...though, I had my own method for progression, since I went by feel and not by a set progression of adding reps at particular times, as above, etc.

I used the day between for mini-cardio sessions.

It all worked.
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Old 06-24-2013, 07:19 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by LindenGarcia18 View Post
I don't get this.

You all told me that eating on a surplus and not challenging yourself and progressing in the gym would quickly result in fat gain.

So if I'm lifting really light weights, and gaining a pound of weight a month, how is that going to be mostly muscle like you said it should be?
I wouldn't be challenging myself, and I wouldn't be progressing because I already went through the stage of using really light weights.

You can't tell me one thing and then tell me something that contradicts it and expect me not to put 2 and 2 together and start thinking about fat gain again, when youv'e told me that'd be the case.
If I followed this, I wouldn't be getting stronger until months into it. I wouldn't be using a challenging weight for a long time.

Despite what you all think, I am not in denial.

I know that I'm not going to get fat. I've been shown the process, the evidence in other teens, and I believe you. If I didn't then I wouldn't be doing it would I?

But you can't expect me not to start thinking in that way again when you tell me something that contradicts the philosophy youv'e been telling me about progressing and getting stronger each week.

I see what's being said here, but I don't understand it.


Whats more, theres not much point in me being here on the forum anymore.

I have no experience to offer anybody else, and most of the people that we're helping me have gotten sick of my situation.

I see a pattern here with people jumping to conclutions about the questions I ask without really reading them, and the same thing happened yesterday.


I told you all I'd started and that I believed and trusted the fact that I wasn't going to get fat.

What you'd told me made sense, but then you go and contradict it and make it confusing.
I was assured that I'd be able to build more muscle than fat and end up looking better , providing I was challenging myself with my lifting.

When you then say "you have to use rediculously light wieghts" What do you expect I'm going to think?

One minuet youv'e told me non of the diet stuff matters if the lifting isn't right, that eating on a surplus will quickly result in fat gain if you arn't challenging yourslef in the gym, that the reason people ffail on a bulk is because they arn't challenging themsleves and working out hard enough, that if I don't stop doing jump and split squats, and don't do proper heavy squats that I will get fat.

Non of the above now seems to apply considering what you told me to do.


So then when I'm completely confused about the whole situation and ask or help in the shout box, everyones pissed off at me for mentioning it!


I'm getting better with the OCD and fear of fat gain. I am. But this makes it 10 times worse. Especially now that its caused yet another influential member to stop helping me because they're sick of it.
Hi Linden,

I sympathise with you, I really do. But after surfing the entire internet, you wont find a better place than on here in my limited experience. And you need to surround yourself with like-minded lifters! So persist. In a while you will be able to offer valuable advice and support to someone else coming along.

I think you just need to have a bit more patience in trying to read into what your body is doing. Imagine you're learning to drive and someone tells you to accelerate to 50, but don't do more than 70. You've got no idea how much pressure you need to apply to the accelerator, and there's little point in asking since people cant explain it. But its no big deal, because the speed reacts withing a few seconds of you moving your leg and hey presto, you control the speed roughly quite quickly.
Changes in the body are not so fast! The feedback takes time, and nothing can be read into daily measurements (weight on the scales or on the bar). So you need some patience. The feedback will come in time, and you will be able to adjust and you will be fine. Just as it takes time to see results, it also takes time to screw things up, so there's no need worry. As they say on here, trust Steve and trust the process (even though its slow)
Hope this helps.
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Old 06-24-2013, 07:42 AM   #13
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Hi Linden,

I sympathise with you, I really do. But after surfing the entire internet, you wont find a better place than on here in my limited experience. And you need to surround yourself with like-minded lifters! So persist. In a while you will be able to offer valuable advice and support to someone else coming along.
I know, I've said that many times myself. There's no place better.

Quote:
I think you just need to have a bit more patience in trying to read into what your body is doing. Imagine you're learning to drive and someone tells you to accelerate to 50, but don't do more than 70. You've got no idea how much pressure you need to apply to the accelerator, and there's little point in asking since people cant explain it. But its no big deal, because the speed reacts withing a few seconds of you moving your leg and hey presto, you control the speed roughly quite quickly.
Changes in the body are not so fast! The feedback takes time, and nothing can be read into daily measurements (weight on the scales or on the bar). So you need some patience. The feedback will come in time, and you will be able to adjust and you will be fine. Just as it takes time to see results, it also takes time to screw things up, so there's no need worry. As they say on here, trust Steve and trust the process (even though its slow)
Hope this helps.
I hear you. Its just far too complicated for me to figure out.
And I can't really keep asking for help because it annoys everyone.

I don't want to hijack the thread anymore anyway.

Last edited by LindenGarcia18; 06-24-2013 at 08:09 AM.
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Old 06-24-2013, 08:13 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by Dray View Post
I like Brooks Kubik - he seems like a great guy in general. However, this doesn't mean he isn't wrong from time to time.
Just because you disagree with someone, doesn't mean they are wrong. I realize you're not a fan of it and you've found something else that works well for you. That's actually exciting to me because I like to think we can all put our personal stamp on our progress, Many paths lead to the same place and I enjoy ALL your thoughts on the subject of lifting.

I'm just trying to help Linden the best way I know how. I've seen this method work many, many times and it has the backing of so many of the top lifters and coaches that nobody can deny it's a practical system. I can rattle off name after name of top lifters that recommend starting light, so many names that it would fill this page. All you need to do is check out some of their logs and ask why some of these 800 lb deadlifters start their cycles off with 400 lbs. . . It's a very common theme to start light and build momentum.
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Old 06-24-2013, 08:36 AM   #15
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Originally Posted by LindenGarcia18 View Post
I don't get this.
Deep Breaths Linden. . .

We aren't saying anything different than what we've said before, you are just finally wrapping your head around more of the information and not just focused on one small aspect of it. Let me see if I can make it a little less scary for you.

Let's look at one lift and take it from there. Let's assume you are struggling with Bench Press and you are currently failing at 5 reps with 100 lbs. Simple math (100 x 5), that's a total of 500 lbs lifted throughout the set.

Now let's take some weight off the bar, let's lower it to 75 lbs, a weight that can be lifted much easier. You start by lifting that weight for 6 reps and you feel it's easy and you feel fresh. Believe it or not, as a new lifter you've probably done enough to cause some adaptation, not much but enough that you can handle the recovery.

Move ahead several weeks, adding reps here and there, and see yourself now lifting that 75 lbs for 12 reps. You were able to do this because you lifted "within yourself" and allowed your body to adapt to the overload gradually. Now simple math says that 75 lbs for 12 reps (75 x 12) is a total weight lifted of 900 lbs throughout the set.

Do the math Linden and you'll see a difference. You've lowered the weight but increased the workload. Now you are ready to do the same thing with 80 lbs, and then 90, and eventually you'll be doing 12 reps with that 100 lbs that you were struggling with. THAT'S PROGRESSION.

Ramping up works because it allows your body to adapt at a rate it can handle. Just like warm-up sets allow you to lift heavier, it prepares your body for what's coming.

Last edited by Off Road; 06-24-2013 at 08:41 AM.
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Old 06-24-2013, 08:49 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by Off Road View Post
Deep Breaths Linden. . .

We aren't saying anything different than what we've said before, you are just finally wrapping your head around more of the information and not just focused on one small aspect of it. Let me see if I can make it a little less scary for you.

Let's look at one lift and take it from there. Let's assume you are struggling with Bench Press and you are currently failing at 5 reps with 100 lbs. Simple math (100 x 5), that's a total of 500 lbs lifted throughout the set.

Now let's take some weight off the bar, let's lower it to 75 lbs, a weight that can be lifted much easier. You start by lifting that weight for 6 reps and you feel it's easy and you feel fresh. Believe it or not, as a new lifter you've probably done enough to cause some adaptation, not much but enough that you can handle the recovery.

Move ahead several weeks, adding reps here and there, and see yourself now lifting that 75 lbs for 12 reps. You were able to do this because you lifted "within yourself" and allowed your body to adapt to the overload gradually. Now simple math says that 75 lbs for 12 reps (75 x 12) is a total weight lifted of 900 lbs throughout the set.

Do the math Linden and you'll see a difference. You've lowered the weight but increased the workload. Now you are ready to do the same thing with 80 lbs, and then 90, and eventually you'll be doing 12 reps with that 100 lbs that you were struggling with. THAT'S PROGRESSION.

Ramping up works because it allows your body to adapt at a rate it can handle. Just like warm-up sets allow you to lift heavier, it prepares your body for what's coming.


Right, I see. That makes perfect sense.

I wasn't seeing it from that perspective. I didn't realise that more reps with a lower weight could equate to the same or a higher workload.


So I lifted 47.5kg + an extra 2 pounds of weight to progress like you sugested. Bench Press.

I managed that for 5 sets of 5 reps.

Then the next workout I added another 2 pounds onto that weight. So it was 47.5kg + 4 pounds.

I did 3 sets of 5, but then could barley lift the weight for the remaining 2 sets.

The reasoning behind this I don't fully know, as it could be a number of things.


Using the formula your telling me now, how much weight should I knock off?

Thanks
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Old 06-24-2013, 09:23 AM   #17
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I'm not offroad but most programs recommend knocking off 10-15% of your current working weight and then just do the same process adding weight slowly hope this helps
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Old 06-24-2013, 09:35 AM   #18
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Using the formula your telling me now, how much weight should I knock off?
That's difficult to say since I've never seen you lift and your journal is sporadic, it's hard to give a set percentage. But in general terms, when a stall happens, you generally re-set the weights at about 70-80%. I'd start with that and make your best guess. Remember, it's better to start lower and continue progressing longer than it is to start higher and cut it short. Even if you drop too much off, it's not a waste of a month, it's time well spent learning lifts and building that work ethic. Don't forget to do a little conditioning and eat, eat, eat.
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Old 06-24-2013, 09:36 AM   #19
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I'm not offroad but most programs recommend knocking off 10-15% of your current working weight and then just do the same process adding weight slowly hope this helps
You posted while i was typing
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Old 06-24-2013, 09:42 AM   #20
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You posted while i was typing
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